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Metal work at schools

School projects for boys

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Nobby	09/02/2012 12:05:16
587 forum posts 113 photos	Hi Guys My Grandson want's to be an engineer, but all the projects he is doing at school is cooking. His age is 13 & he love,s helping me in my workshop What's going on? If find the photo of him under instruction on my lathe I will post it Nobby
Diane Carney	09/02/2012 12:52:09
419 forum posts 11 photos	Hi Nobby Our daughter is 13 too. She's just chosen her options, one of which is cooking, but she also loves being in the workshop with her grandad. Last week she was marking out, bandsawing and draw-filing. Schools are obliged to give all children as broad an education as they can which includes cooking. There are probably many in his class that detest the thought of having to do technology, ether 'design' or 'systems' (which is about as close to engineering as schools get as far as I can see). If it's a good school he will be changing about between different kinds of technology subjects. It just happens to be cooking at the moment. Keep bringing him into your workshop; he will learn far more there than any school can teach him anyway. Then he might even make you your tea! (Our Jeanie makes the tea sometimes ... it's great!) Diane
Clive Hartland	09/02/2012 13:44:08
2929 forum posts 41 photos	The last couple of decades has seen a complete decline in technology in schools. This without doubt was through the then Gobment changing policy in education. We cannot find apprentices, they do not want to do manual work but push buttons or surf the internet. I call it, 'Lack of interface between hand and brain'. The basic principles of metal work, recognition of metals and cutting techniques are lost as the young of today live in a throwaway world. Maintenance or repair is lost on them, lucky is the child who has a parent able to teach and hold their attention on things technical. Awaiting a storm of words about this, but remember a lot of machinery came on the market because of schools closing workshops and you may have been lucky and obtained a nice machine at a good price because of it! There is now a new incentive to create an apprenticeship scheme and not before time as industry is screaming out for capable people who are able to read and write properly and be able to do manual skills. Clive
Russell Eberhardt	09/02/2012 14:01:47
2785 forum posts 87 photos	If he wants to be an engineer keep encouraging him in your workshop but also encourage him to learn as much maths and physics as possible. Engineering isn't just about manual skills. Oh, and take him to the Science Museum and other engineering rich visits. Russell (retired chartered engineer) Edited By russell eberhardt on 09/02/2012 14:02:50
AJS	09/02/2012 14:26:47
37 forum posts	To give it its grand title now, cooking is Food Technology. I hope he is doing some cooking rather than writing about it! I am a technician in a 6th form college now, having in my apprentice days 50+ years ago followed the toolmaking/general engineering path. In my experience, teachers now in practical subjects are not trained in metal work at all, in fact newer teachers have very little practical knowledge of woodwork either. They come out of teacher training college with a degree which is fine, and may well be able to teach the theory necessary for their students to pass appropriate exams. However, they have not trained in the practical side of the subjects to any extent and rely on us technicians to fill in the gaps. Maybe that is fine but we are a rarer breed I fear, (69 next week), and when we have gone so will a lot of skills which are not taught any more, but it seems are still required. Alan (ex I Eng)
Nobby	09/02/2012 14:55:53
587 forum posts 113 photos	Hi Again Both my Grandsons are good with computers So They may be good at programming c n c machines . I went back to college in my 50s I'M 74 now and got distinction in nc/cnc part programming I hope they can do that . My son was an aircraft engineer & worked on the last Sunderland at Calshot that went to the USA. Thank for all your replys Nobby
Ady1	09/02/2012 15:00:54
6137 forum posts 893 photos	Health and safety and child protection stuff and being sued if junior gets hurt means we are de-skilling our youngsters Our children are going to be the safest best educated zero-practical-skills people in human history If you want to teach kids useful stuff nowadays you must do it yourself. Don't rely on those government bods, they're all idiots with weird agendas
Kevin Bennett	09/02/2012 15:04:48
193 forum posts 56 photos	Hi all my grandson is only 9 months old and I cannot wait to get him in my workshop the hand over all my knowledge and experiences and getting him working. I also have the full support of his Dad as well as from next month we have him all day as his mum goes back to work full time. Good time ahead Ty Kevin
David Clark 1	09/02/2012 15:27:28
3357 forum posts 112 photos 10 articles	Hi Ady 1 I would disagree that they are going to be the safest. Not having learnt the hard way, I doubt they have any safety sense. regards David
Nobby	09/02/2012 17:24:56
587 forum posts 113 photos	Hi Guys Found photo of Grandson in my workshop under supervision . A bit younger in this.
Jon	09/02/2012 20:39:19
1001 forum posts 49 photos	Cant see what hes doing Nobby. Many valid comments above, i think the health and safety garbage has put to bed any form of on the job training in schools even if they did have some one passed off to use the machinery. Too many what iffs. Quite true Clockie i am an even rarer breed being one of three people alive and one of two below retirement age in the world with specific know how on what i used to do. When its gone its gone and millions of £ as good as scrap. Even 25 year ago graduates were frowned upon by everyone except the people that took them on. Life in reality is totally different to than in practice. All it means they have the ability to learn from a book or pc in theory. We all know theory dont exactly work and common sense prevails. Theres no better training than 'in at the deep end' ie get grafting no namby pamby over the top protection slowing things down 6 fold. Ludicrous what you see on telly Health and Safety gone stupid, the root of all evil. Quiet agree also David having had to work with a few, quite scary and had to be told several times with warnings and still kept on doing unsafe things because they had no comprehension of working a machine and getting the feeling for whats happening.
Stub Mandrel	09/02/2012 21:08:22
4318 forum posts 291 photos 1 articles	I had my own workshop from about 13/14. No real power tools though but a soldering iron and a Juneero - and I could nick my Dad's power drill. Mostly just messing about with bits and pieces and making plastic kits, model boats and electronics. Always thought model engineering was for retirement - getting a mini lathe at age 37 was brilliant decision! Neil
The Merry Miller	09/02/2012 22:13:58
484 forum posts 97 photos	Lovely to see the word "Juneero" again Stub. What happy memories I have of this tool from when I was very young. Len. P.
jason udall	09/02/2012 22:20:40
2032 forum posts 41 photos	new problem added...It has been stated that "Any firm taking on under 18s. Need to have all staff CRB checked and "Child Protection" trained...apprentiships or even employment for under 18's looks dead in the water.
Ian P	09/02/2012 22:53:39
2747 forum posts 123 photos	My granddaughter is 7 and is hooked on soldering! Like most children she is inquisitive and a quick learner, in fact I am flabbergasted at how competent her and her sister (3 years) are at using computers and smart phones. Once they know which button accesses a 'app' or saves the drawing they've done they remember it. They even cope with different operating systems without thinking about it. The soldering I mentioned is on printed circuit boards, I bought some of the simpler kits made by Velleman and let her read and follow the instructions, insert all the components and solder them. She has made a LED star and a LED Xmas tree on normal PCB, also an illuminated badge on a surface mount board. I think its too early for her to do mechanical work in the workshop but the biggest satisfaction I get is seeing how she has become interested in what makes things work. Apart for guiding her I let her do everything herself, she installed over 60 LEDs on the star, and every one was the correct polarity, probably a better success rate that me! Ian P
Clive Hartland	10/02/2012 08:52:00
2929 forum posts 41 photos	From the posts offered you can see that the young ones are, 'Self motivated' This is a good thing as that motivation will carry on and they will not forget the lessons learnt. This brings up:- Where is the motivation for the rest of the youngsters? Now the subject of CRB testing for instructors for work with under 16's. It is a fact I would not be interested as I am sure my motivation would be gone by the time 6 to 9 months have gone by to obtain it! Legislation has the whole country by the throat and has stifled the life out of any project even before it starts. Clive
Nobby	10/02/2012 10:59:13
587 forum posts 113 photos	Hi Clive & Guys My two grandsons are scouts . And there Mother said she would help the group as it was going to close because the leaders were leaving . You guessed it she has to be vetted etc In the meantime the group is closed. In the 60s I was vice chairman of the local model club no problems. Nobby
Russell Eberhardt	10/02/2012 11:14:10
2785 forum posts 87 photos	Posted by David Clark 1 on 09/02/2012 15:27:28: Hi Ady 1 I would disagree that they are going to be the safest. Not having learnt the hard way, I doubt they have any safety sense. regards David Absolutely! If kids aren't exposed to any danger they never learn to spot it and avoid it. While I was at school I made fireworks and various explosives and had many electric shocks from my home projects. Wouldn't be allowed now. Posted by jason udall on 09/02/2012 22:20:40: new problem added...It has been stated that "Any firm taking on under 18s. Need to have all staff CRB checked and "Child Protection" trained...apprentiships or even employment for under 18's looks dead in the water. When this idiocy was introduced I was teaching martial arts to children and adults as a volunteer for many years. I stopped teaching the children rather than pay for the checking and training. It's the children who suffer. Russell.
Ady1	10/02/2012 12:14:10
6137 forum posts 893 photos	Anyone who works with the public gets checked now. Taxi drivers Scout Leaders etc etc The fines etc for breaking the rules can be pretty hefty Apparently Queen Elizabeth broke the rules by visiting two different schools within a single month while not being CRB certified To date she remains at large and has not been arrested and bundled into a police car
Peter G. Shaw	10/02/2012 13:41:32
1531 forum posts 44 photos	I have two grandsons and a granddaughter. To date, only one of those three has shown any interest in practical stuff - and he showed it when he was five and asked if he could knock the plastic plugs into holes in the wall after he had seen me do one. So I let him, and OK, we had to stop him knocking through into next doors, but he was successful. And that's been the story right through the years - let him have a go, even if he made a mess of it (never did by the way). The result is that today, at 16, he is capable of having a go, and making a creditable job of, just about anything he needs to. Even his engineering teacher at school (proper engineering by the way) said how good he was. Unfortunately, he eventually decided against engineering and is instead doing an agricultural engineering course (ie maintenance and repair of agricultural machinery) at an Agricultural College with the possibility of going on to do a degree course. Not really surprising actually as his father runs an agricultural contracting business and the lad himself has already passed his trtor driving test. But it's interesting what he can do: design & build, with help, a three story guinea pig hut; raised vegatable growing beds; removed a broken key from a lock and other things as well. And yes, I'm proud. And why not? Regards, Peter G. Shaw

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