Aircraft General Discussion

Apparently BBC Breakfast had some items about the Vulcan this morning (Tuesday), Might be interesting, have to see if it is available on the I Player.

The Vulcan may be grounded, but it appears that a Victor may be on its way to take it's place, there is also a Shackleton being restored. From what I'v heard it's a bit of a race to see which is first, although I think the Victor go air bourn on a fast taxi.

Ian S C

You will have to search for it but somewhere on YouTube is a video of a Victor taxiing at speed when it unfortunately began to lift off, much to the consternation of the pilot. I did land safely though, and just in time as it was going to run out of runway.

"a Victor taxiing at speed when it unfortunately began to lift off" ... Must have been the later Mk, although even those were 'ground huggers'! One of the 'moments of interest' when we were on standby S&R in Cyprus was watching the Victor take-off with guesses as to how little runway would remain before lift-off. Probably the best looking of the V force, but better IN the air than getting there!

rgds

Bill

It made a final flight around Robin Hood airport yesterday. About 20 minutes with a veteran at the controls.

Neil

I think this shows what the old girl was still capable of

https://youtu.be/7kuE9A8bOzQ

Gordon.

Re the Victor which accidentally took off, I found a second video yesterday with the actual pilot, a veteran Vulcan pilot. He explained that when he ordered his co-pilot to shut the throttles, the co-pilot simply froze. The pilot then had to let go of his controls and lean across to shut the throttles himself hence the brief take off.

Howard Hughs had similar problems with the Hercules/Spruce Goose

Gives ya goosey bumps

I have a question. I know of the Doppler Effect, where the pitch of an approaching train horn or whistle rises, then falls as it passes and recedes. I have, however noticed that the whine of a jet aircraft, whether the Vulcan or the local police helicopter, appears to rise in pitch as it recedes. Any idea why this is?

Geoff

Unlike a horn or whistle a jet engine is a complex device with each major component producing noise with a range of frequencies and amplitudes. In addition the "radiation" of these noises is not uniform around the engine. I would say that the rise in pitch as the engine recedes from the listener comes from the turbine.

The old Hawker Hunter had a distinctive drumming noise from the compressor. It was very obvious when the aircraft was flying straight at one.

JA

I'm not someone who get particularly excited about airliners (at least modern ones) but I was up on Barr Beacon this morning and it was obviously smack under the final approach for Birmingham Airport in the lovely bright, still but hazy conditions. A great opportunity to flex the zoom and image stabilisation capabilities of my camera:

Having watched the Victor at Bruntingthorpe many times I cant see how it could "just lift off" as it leapt quite a distance off the ground, makes me wonder if they gave the stick a tug to much.

Martin P

Martin, I did mention Howard Hughs and the Spruce Goose. I imagine it has happened with other aircraft.

Ian S C

I always understood that there were 2 points about taking off, V1 where they could abort the take off and V2 where the speed then committed them to lift the plane as an abort was then a crash? The Victor was unladen and therefore light and the flight characteristics totally different,. Taxiing at a low speed just enough to show the public a moving aircraft. Luckily the Victor came to a stop before it hit the end of the runway and even then I think it went onto the grass.

Clive

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Not a short video but worth watching. So make yourself a cuppa first.

Nick

V1 is the rejected take off max speed. It varies depending on weight, runway length and conditions etc but is a ground only speed. All other speeds are aerodynamic. Once over V1 you are committed to fly. Vr is the rotate speed and V2 is the minimum speed for climb on one engine (or 2 engines if you want to go up like a bat out of hell) (Best angle of climb) for obstacle clearance. Once reaching Aa (acceleration altitude) usually 1000 feet above aerodrome altitude you accelerate to Vfs (which on 2 engines you will probably be above) which is flap retraction speed.

Airliners are normally trimmed before take off for a V2 climb ready in case of a engine failure and re trimmed after take off when safely in the climb.

Thanks for explaining that Paul, I have only ever heard of the V1 and Vr/V2. I understand there is a standard procedure for takeoff .

Clive

As an apprentice in 1963 - 1968, I helped to build fuselage jigs and later helped fit the the Auxillary Air intake doors for the TSR2. Until a few years ago, I used sample cockpit glass as small surface plates. These were glass / silicone sandwiches about 1" thick.
BobH

I seem to remember a model of the TSR2. I think it was on a cornflake packet or similar. Lasted longer than the real one!