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Small workshop projects for 8 - 11 year olds?

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Dennis WA11/02/2012 18:28:02
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Looking at Nobby's post on metal work at schools (http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=65019) leads me to ask you grandfathers what projects have you got your pre-teenage grandchildren to do in your workshops?
 
The emphasis is on absolute beginners making something themselves with grandpa's role being mainly supervisory. The aim is to impart some skills and to leave the youngster keen to continue to "have a go". Hopefully some machine work would be involved.
 
It goes without saying that safe working practices are a must!
 
 
 
Peter G. Shaw11/02/2012 21:50:14
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I can't remember what got my grandson going, but he has done turning, hand threading, machine screwcutting and carbon steel hardening. Plus some filing and other general hand tool work. Whatever it was, it paid off because his engineering teacher at school immediately recognised that he had been exposed to engineering. Generally though, I let him do whatever he wanted.
 
Mind you, he has been allowed to use some of the tools from an early age: apparently he got a little upset when his mother refused to buy him a vertical drilling machine!
 
Regards,
 
Peter G. Shaw
Wolfie11/02/2012 22:10:10
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502 forum posts
This is exactly how I got started, I remember being left with my granddad who as usual was in his garage.
 
I seem to remember melting solder and dropping it into a bucket of water to make 'ball bearings' haha.
 
As for my own, I arn't got any children yet let alone grandbairns
Bazyle11/02/2012 23:19:11
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If they are at all technical then they will have Meccano so how about making some compatible parts. There are opportunities at all skill levels, from simply drilling to gear cutting.
Wolfie12/02/2012 00:22:16
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502 forum posts
Meccano still exists?? I haven't seen it since I was small.
Ian S C12/02/2012 06:13:28
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Wolfie, the French took it over. here in NZ we also get a Chinese vertion, the two are not compatable, Meccano is still imperial size, while the Chinese stuff has 10 mm hole spacing.
A few years back there was a young lad (similar age to the ones above)who with his granddad built an oscillator steam engine, and boiler, I think he mad a simple hot air engine, and entered in competition, and got a prize (?), hes proberbly in his twenties now, if hes still in model engineering, maybe he might see this, and tell us more. Ian S C
Romeo R.L12/02/2012 07:56:54
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Maybe a small ocillating engine or stuart 10v, the ocillator is simpler to build but 10v has more skill involved to build it
Ian S C12/02/2012 11:12:49
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7468 forum posts
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I would suggest that the Stuart 10V might wait for a year or so, they could then do the build together. Ian S C
Engine Builder12/02/2012 11:51:13
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267 forum posts
How about this simple engine. Can be made without machine tools but they could be used if available. Hundreds of free plans have been sent out. They are being made as school projects in the UK and US.
 

Jeff Dayman12/02/2012 14:30:37
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For total beginners with no tool experience, making simple screwdrivers, small ballpein hammers with metal handles, and centre punches is useful. Not much precision required, mistakes can be fixed easily, and the kids end up with tools they can actually use later. Also exposes them to many basic ops and hand tools. I've also found with our neighborhood kids that they really enjoy making anything in shiny brass, aluminum a close second. The ones I've worked with really like forging flat screwdriver blades out of 3/16 or 1/4 dia drill rod in my charcoal forge. Put that in a handle made of 5/8 or 3/4 dia aluminum, with a couple of setscrews on flats ground on the blade shank, and you have a useful tool. The kids can have fun with the handle shape on the lathe, and get some drill and tap experience as well. Afte doing a few little tools like these they are much more ready to take on some kind of engine.
 
For engines, some plans for really simple ones with nifty motion can be found at
 
Colin G12/02/2012 14:59:55
25 forum posts
In the 60's or 70,s ? there were a series of booklets produced for school teachers
called STEP by STEP METALWORK anyone remember them ? I have a poor
copy of No3 by Kenneth Wells. This covers the construction of a spirit fired boiler
and single cylinder oscillating plant and also its conversion into a traction engine
very similar in size and design to Mamod.
The booklet consists of over 90 A4 pages full of plans,photographs and information
for the student and teacher.I would imagine that this issue was aimed at the 11+
age group.
Mike12/02/2012 15:48:48
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713 forum posts
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Twenty-odd years ago I instructed my then 10-year-old nephew in exactly the exercise outlined by Geoff - making screwdrivers with silver steel blades and aluminium handles. For the lathe-work phase I wired an extension lead with a push button through the emergency stop switch, so that I could stand close behind him and stop the lathe instantly if I had to. I never had to.
In addition to simple turning and knurling, he learned how to forge, harden and temper steel. He loved the workshop, but the main reward was mine in being able to pass on an enthusiasm for engineering. If you get the chance to teach a youngster, do, please, take it.
SteveW12/02/2012 15:57:51
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140 forum posts
11 photos
I would also suggest getting a rule marked just in sixteenths on one edge and eighths on the other. Getting a novice to read a rule maked down to 1/32 (or worse...) is just too difficult. Obviously sometimes you need to; but fractions are difficult enough.
 
Metric not quite as bad...
 
Steve W
 
Colin - I can remember that book and one detailing an oscillator with a casting as the base/frame we made many that worked with classes in the 70's but by late 80's we were into cardboard and the nasty machines were being ripped out.
jason udall12/02/2012 16:55:54
2032 forum posts
41 photos
hate to cast a downer on this.
If youngsters(yes we might think under teens but this now in uk means under 18!) are not allowed to buy any thing that may be used or modified into a weapon . How do we dare show them how to take inoccious bar and teach them how to make sharp objects !


Seriously I like the marking out tools and a small tool case....engins come and go but instuments are fo ever..the techniques of fabrication and 'calibration' will serve for all life.
Scriber...simple turning..heat treat.
Center punch ...simular..
Set square....precisiob filing etc.
Center finder...
Dividers....
Odd leg calipers...
Saddly almost all pointy....

jason udall12/02/2012 17:01:19
2032 forum posts
41 photos
also from past experience..short duration projects ...do able in one or two sessions..maybe with larger project in parallel
Serve best...need frequent positive results...
Nobby12/02/2012 18:05:08
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587 forum posts
113 photos
Hi Dennis Guys

I would say some small tools they could use later ie firm joint callipers Small centre finder

. Wolfie meccano you can find at car boot sales My list is similar to Jason's . My Grandson loves filing & helps me cleaning up some of my projects I suppose more youngsters could ask some more questions

Nobby

Dennis WA12/02/2012 18:21:09
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79 forum posts
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Good ideas and links posted so far. Thanks.
 
Especially valuable are those projects that youngsters were really enthusiastic about - I'd like my 3 grandsons to retain a practical engineering ability and interest in later life.
 
Jeff and Mike - I appreciate your thoughts about starting with tools - I think bp hammer and screwdriver to begin, followed by a very simple heat engine or "pop-pop" boat.
 
I agree on short duration so that a finished product is quickly produced, with its"sense of achievement".
 
 
Bazyle12/02/2012 19:15:31
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6956 forum posts
229 photos
Although Meccano is now most often seen retailed as small kits to build eg a car or robot there is masses on ebay and several full time traders in new and second hand parts. Lots of new standard parts are made in India and I think South America as well as by the legal owners of the name.
Parents are managing to find it. At a recent model railway show where we displayed engineering models but also a meccano beam engine (one member makes something different each year) at least 50% of the kids of both sexes had some and identified with it better than with train models.
 
martin perman12/02/2012 19:16:59
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2095 forum posts
75 photos
Gentlemen,
 
How you all bring back memories, my Grandfather taught both my Brother and I to use his lathe, the lathe was a Brittannia Treadle lathe which my brother still has, he got us making wooden whistles which involved turning, drilling, the use of a hacksaw and files.
My Brother and I have spoken of this recently and we are both sure that we were no more than five and three and a half, I being the oldest when we were first shown how to use these tools. What followed was how to fire model steam boats and traction engines and we used to attend Victoria pond in London to help him with his boats.
 
We both now are engineers in similar jobs and both have our own workshops for our various projects, not modelling but restoration of Stationary engines and Tractors. I attend ME shows because I like to see what you gentlemen get up to and for tooling etc.
 
Martin Perman
Mike Poole12/02/2012 22:03:07
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3676 forum posts
82 photos
The first thing I remember making in metalwork was the tin can turbine. There are many ways to make it but it can include riveting, soldering, drilling, simple machining. It will require some marking out but the accuracy is not hyper critical. Providing a tin can of the correct sort is used (a pop off lid)then the finished project is safe even with too much heat applied. Supervised steaming is probably advisable depending on the age of the constructor. A satisfying project for a youngster as you can watch the wheels go round after a few hours work.
Mike

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