What did you do today? (2013)

Jason -

That base looks fantastic painted. You make the whiole thing appear infuriatingly simple.

Windy -

4000 psi? I've just been telling my wide about this mad pensioner speed freak - I hope we are able to come and see one of your record attempts when the weather gets better!

Neil

Today I looked after my poorly 4 year old, using up a day's precious leave which was planned for other things. But tonight I got out in the back garden before the sun left for the day then I came inside and drew up the plans for my new, first, workshop. 10ft by 10ft square internally so should give me enough room for the Barker, Elliott 10M and Chester Champion and will be a darned sight warmer than the garage I am in now. By next winter I should be metal chewing in the warmth

Hope your youngster has perked up a bit John and that it was nothing serious!

Finished off overhauling and rebushing a Winterhalder and Hofmaier quarter chiming 'ting tang' bracket clock, quite a tussle with the brute because the last joker that had a go at it made a real balls up of it!
They'd fitted pivot bushes and left them overhanging inside and outside the plates, so the oil sinks looked a right old eysore and the inside bits were making the trains bind!
Add to that no oil on anything, which had caused brass from the plates to ball up on the mainspring barrel arbours and train pivots making a right damned mess to clean up!

All's well that ends well though, and it's ticking and chiming away happily keeping company with an Art Deco' garniture clock I finished a couple of days ago ............ starting to drive my missus nuts with all the ticking and chiming going on!

The brass visible on the arbours was actually embedded where metal had been torn out of the surface, the mainsprings on this thing are heavy and don't take prisoners when there's no lubricant on anything!

Edited By RJW on 02/04/2013 22:52:33

Hi

Posted a few items . Then cleaned and oiled my old S7 Mk 1 turned an unsurported test peice over 5" very pleased
Nobby

Hi Niel

This mad pensioner is adicted to speed like the lads and lasses get salt fever at Bonneville salt flats speed records.

If younger and had a fat bank balance it would be a full size record attempt steam car project.

When doing my motor bike thing another mad pensioner Bert Monroe was at Bonneville with a modified Indian.

These speed pensioners rarely give up hopefully another contender at the end of the year will have a full size steam water speed record.

Paul

Hi Paul

"Bert Monroe was at Bonneville with a modified Indian. "

Was that the one featured in the film " The Last Indian"? I hired that some years ago and watched it through three times in the week end! My (then) 8year old Grandson was with us on one of the nights and enjoyed it as much as I did.

Norman

Yes Norman that's the man I had just started motorbike sprinting and there was mention in MCN press about Bert Monroe.

Great days and there are people today all over the world who are still trying to fulfil their speed dreams be it mechanical or athletic.

Paul

Edited By Windy on 03/04/2013 11:10:05

I knew Bert as a patient in hospital when I was doing my nursing training in Invercargill (down the bottom end of the South Island NZ), Bert's home town. I see that Indian in the USA have built a replica of berts bike with a brand new design engine. Ian S C

Took my little dog to the vets and when I got back started decorating again, missing my workshop

Bob.

For the last couple of days, SWMBO has been away visiting family so got stuck into 'sorting' an inherited long case clock and a heavyweight mantel job. The long case had been knocked over by the tenant's kids and the damage had (supposedly) been repaired!! Not so ... the case was badly split and the door lock and hinges bodged. Biggest problem was that the escapement crutch was MISSING!! They come in quite a variety of shapes and forms, and, without the original, what to fit? Eventually decide to try making one from Delrin and, after much fiddling, the clock runs continuously but gains about 5 minutes a day. Remaining brain cell (singular1) says that the bob weight needs to be lower (longer pendulum) so have done so.

The mantel clock had stopped after SWMBO wound it and the minute hand seized. Eventually managed to get at the works and nothing obviously awry. Prodded and fiddled and, surprise, surprise, the thing started to tick - on its face, without the pendulum! Not knowing why it had started, I reckoned it was better left alone and so it remains on the table, sans case. ticking away merrily, while I decide on the next move! I have told SWMBO (now returned) that it MUST stay where it is 'cos that is part of the remedial work!!

Would RJW have any long distance advice, please?

Rgds

Bill

Just got back from a 2 hour session in the gym and tucked into a welcome lunch and shovelled in all the calories I'd burned off, hey ho, such is life!

Bill, on your longcase, there are generally two crutch replacements available, a short one (132mm) and a long one (137mm), these will generally fit either 8 day or 30 hour clocks, and as you've found when they're missing it's pot luck or a load of measuring and arithmetic to calculate which length will do!

Now, I readilly admit to being a lazy bugger in the maths dep't these days, so as long as there's sufficient threaded rod on the pendulum for a sizeable adjustment, I usually buy the longest, and so far they've always been spot on, it can't just be luck because I've never won the lottery!

You'll also find at the top of the pendulum rod a brass block to which is attached the bottom end of the suspension spring, the foot of the crutch should sit midway on that block, otherwise if too high, the foot will tend to 'rock' the top of the pendulum rod over being too close to the suspension spring rather than impulsing the pendulum fully, the result being power lost on each impulse and the clock will eventually stop!

The pendulum block should also be a nice sliding fit in the foot of the crutch, if the slot is too big, you'll hear a double tick, one from the escapement, the other from the crutch clouting the block, conversely, if the block is tight inside the slot, the clock is likely to stop because of drag caused by the block being unable to shift on each vibration, the block will be moving in a slightly different arc of movement than the foot of the crutch even if miniscule because their points of suspension are different.
The foot of the crutch should also be set as near 90 Deg to the movement backplate as possible, otherwise each end of the slot in the foot will describe a different arc of movement as it vibrates and impart the same on the pendulum rod causing it to oscillate, you'll see this as the bob wobbling around, it's also another cause of a clock stopping because the block which is rectangular in section, again can't move if the foot is sitting slightly 'diagonal' across the sides!

As you say, to correct for a gain, the bob needs lowering on the rod!

John.

The later oil guns (made by Wanner for Myford) work as they should and do not leak, but they are a little expensive.

Bill, On your mantle clock, it's anyone's guess what could be wrong with it, but it's probably well overdue for a bit of TLC and bone dry of oil on the pivots, plus, generally if it stopped after winding, it's probably the mainspring that's dry and gummed with old grease and possibly 'set' due to old age and fatigue (tell me about it)!
When this happens, the coils get stuck together and no longer transmit power, this also applies in the same way to wristwatches which are then usually dubbed as being 'overwound'

If the minute hand was seized, it could be anything from dry or badly worn pivots to something gone awry on the striking mechanism, (if it's a chimer) which usually happens when the hand is somewhere near the '5 to' position and tripping the warning for the strike, but if it's just a timepiece, then dry pivots and muck!

Even worn out old dogs will generally tick away like crazy when the pendulum is removed, even if miles out of beat because there's no mass of the bob to impulse!

I doubt it will be out of beat suddenly unless SWIMBO gave it a monumental shove, however, some mantle clocks have a self setting facility for setting in beat, you can check this on yours with the movement being out!
Try pushing the solid part of the crutch to one side (not the loose leader rod if fitted) until the pallets lock on the escape wheel, then push a tad further to move the crutch on the pallet arbour, if it moves very easily, it's probably self setting, if it's tight, then it's a traditional friction collet to allow the crutch to be moved and stay put in that position, if it won't move at all, bad luck, it's the type that requires the crutch rod to be bent to set a clock in beat and can be a right PIA to get spot on!
For self setters, move the pendulum well to one side and let go, the pendulum will eventually settle down into a normal rhythm and in beat!

What you could try short term Bill, and if you're feeling brave, is let down the mainspring(s) to release the coils, but it's only really a short term check to see if they are stuck, and if so, you'll hear and feel them thud when the coils let go, to do this, take off the dial and look for the ratchet wheels on the winding arbours, against these you'll see the clicks with a spring bearing on them!

Fit the key and 'wind' Just sufficient to release pressure on the click, then hold the click off the ratchet wheel and clear of the teeth by pressing on the 'ear' of the click, then gently release 'some' of the spring tension and re-engage the click, keep repeating this until fully unwound,
Warning! be Very Careful doing this, because if you drop your guard or lose grip on the key for a nanosecond, it'll give your fingers a monumental rap leaving your DNA all over the front of the clock and wherever else the ears on the key centrifuge it as it emulates a propellor!
The upside (when the pain subsides), is a nice warm glowing sensation in your fingers, the downside, (apart from flesh sprayed around and pain for a while when washing hands) is that the inner coil of the spring which once grabbed the hook on the barrel arbour now probably won't because of the recoil, and will require the clock stripping anyway to rectify said damage !
Don't ask me how I know!

A good tip for letting down clock springs, is to cut a slot in an old door knob for the ears of the key, then shove it over the key, gives lots of control and avoids self mutilation!

When you've done all that, put a spot of oil on all visible pivots and wind the clock up again, if it's still dead, time to get the spanners out, and if you've never done one before, I recommend a digital camera too to capture images of all the scary bits .............. especially on 3 train Westminster + Whittington chimers!

John

Edited By RJW on 03/04/2013 15:10:54

Hi there, Kwil,

I wonder if your oil gun is the same as mine because mine certainly doesn't seal properly.

The front end works fairly well, the problem is with the filler cap. As I posted in a recent thread, I have the same problem with both the old style and the new style guns.

The design of the gun expects/requires the disk of leather/plastic in the filler cap to seal on the thickness of the 20 SWG wall of the oil gun body.

It has about as much chance of doing that successfully as I have of winning the Lottery (even if I bought a ticket!)

I've been toying with a scheme to modify the filler cap to use an O-ring but I don't have a convincing scheme worked-out yet.

Best regards,

Swarf, Mostly!

RJW - John, many thanks for a super run-down on the clock problems (and possible fixes!). At the moment (fingers firmly crossed) the long case is tick-tocking away and has been doing so for about four days, so am hopeful that it will continue. Bob adjustment is going to be difficult as the extension thread on the pendulum is nadgered and fatigue-shortened so may have to fiddle-factor an add-on! The mantel clock continues to wobble away and, having heard previous horror stories of letting down springs, I am content to let it do its own thing for a day or three.

Interesting details re. the self-setters not come across that before. Suspect that this is not that sophisticated. Will try a little careful oiling and see if things improve.

The long case dial is inscribed Thos Major, Bantry - can't find any details for him, in Baillies or on the web, so presumably a one-off.

Rgds

Bill

Managed to get a couple of hours tonight re-assembling parts onto my Studer cylindrical grinder.

Made a mandrel and did a trial spring wind with some 0.024" guitar strings. First attempt a bit uneven and slightly oversize so, I think a spring winding tool is on the cards.

Graeme

A few years ago I made a QCTP (post and clamp style) with about 12 "normal" toolholders. Recently I came to the conclusion that I needed some more toolholders, as time was being wasted changing cutters etc. So I bought some metal and proceeded to make swarf.

Todays task was to make the hole (34.6mm diameter) through the 25mm thickness of material to suit the post. In the mill it was progressively drilled up to my biggest drill, 13mm, then it was over to the boring head. Three hours later there was a nice parallel hole that proved to be an excellent fit on the post.

My problem with this was the time taken. For the rest I might use the 4 jaw chuck on the lathe, as I'm much better equipped to bore holes on the lathe.

If I remember I had the same issue with the first batch. I tried a hole saw to get rid of the bulk of the material, but that didn't work too well. Then I resorted to the 4J on the lathe

What do others think?

cheers

Bill

Bill, for the adjusting rod on the pendulum, take off the nut and pull the rod out of the bob, cut off the threaded rod flush with the end of the tapered rectangular section rod which fits inside the bob, then drill into the end a few millimetres - this can be a fiddle because the width is quite shallow, I use an archimedian drill on these, it's slower but you can eyeball it level better.

Take a suitable length of threaded rod probably BA screws or similar (make sure you've a similar suitable brass nut to the original - which is likely to be stripped anyway), then turn or file down the end to a diameter and length to a snug fit in the hole, then soft solder into place - you could superglue it, but some purists would pour scorn on that mehod, but as the part isn't especially stressed other than from the weight of the bob, it's strong enough!
Being a model engineer though, I'm sure you could knock out a suitable threaded rod and nut to your own spec' and keep the job 'hand made'

Also clean up the rectangular section of the rod with fine wet or dry so it's a nice sliding fit inside the bob and wax it, being tapered, they often get stuck in lead filled or cast iron bobs due to rust and crap building up and why the rods and nuts get stripped or sheared off, it's always a good idea anyway to lift the bob slightly when adjusting the rating nut just to take the weight off it!

John

Bill, Re the clockmaker 'Major', it's not likely to be a 'one off' more than likely that Loomes and Bailey haven't recorded any known examples by that maker, each edition that gets published includes many more previously unknown makers!
My Loomes Vol II book is 31mm thick, Vol III by comparison is 50mm, such is the number of additions!

Major may also not have been a product of the apprenticeship system in that he didn't become a Freeman of the Clockmakers company which would have entitled him to engrave his name of movements and dials, and many such crafts people moved around a lot to avoid arrest!
There is also the possibility of the name being a 'Vanity' engraving and could actually be the name of the person for whom the clock was manufactured, or even the name of the maker and the place of residence of the owner!

There are 11 clockmakers by the name of Major in Loomes 3rd edition of Watch & Clockmakers of the World, and most of them in the Midlands and South of England - Evesham & Stourbridge, Brighton, London, Devon, Cheltenham, Nottingham, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if your chap was related to one of these and decided to 'up sticks' and move to the South Western tip of Ireland!
I have a pocket watch made by a Huddersfield maker who moved lock stock and barrel to Filey for some reason, which must have been a bit of an upheaval back in 1850, a lot of them did the same, many even swapping countries!

John.

Edited By RJW on 04/04/2013 10:24:38

Bill P.,

I know it sounds like admitting defeat, but why not see if you can get a local engineering company with a big drill to drill all your blocks within a mm or 3 of finished size?

Neil