Diesel sales down 21.7%

Surprised that noone has, so far, mentioned the statistics compiled for the "More or Less" programme on the Beeb - "The 16 largest marine bulk carriers produce MORE pollution than ALL the world's motor vehicles put together" !!

OK, so it's statistics manipulation in essence (as are all the other hysterical reactions) but, the fact remains, ships use "bunker fuel" which is the filthiest , most air polluting of all the distillates and what is heard of it?? "Nah, don't bovver wiv ships, mate - they're out at sea an out of sight, ain't they". Still, if the great unwashed are wittering on about the evils of diesel pollution they won't have time to notice the REAL problems we're facing!!

rgds

Bill

They do environmentalism in this country for all the wrong reasons. There's almost nothing in the way of incentives to reduce waste.

Michael W

I don't think you can fuel a car with Orimulsion, even if it is blessed with one of Herr Diesel's little wonders

I heard something different and will have to listen to it again! I think the programme investigated a Guardian article that made that claim and debunked it.

If I understood properly, the particular pollutant was Sulphur, and the figures were taken from a 'what will happen if we don't do anything about it study' done in the US. They interviewed the chap responsible who said that the report had resulted in an International Agreement to clean up Bunker Fuel, and as a result, the predicted sulphur pollution never happened. Various other points about the comparison being dubious were made, for example petrol and diesel don't contain a lot of Sulphur in the first place.

But Bill is absolutely right that shipping is a major source of pollution. On the bright side, if bulk carriers were banned it would fix our car pollution problem as well; no oil tankers = no diesel, petrol or lubricants = no cars. Job done! Slightly worrying, it would also mean no agricultural machinery or fertilizers. I might have to eat the cat!

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 06/10/2017 15:46:44

Climate change and vehicle pollution are political playthings as well as a major tax revenue source.

In the western world we pay all sorts of vehicle and fuel taxes reportedly to reduce climate change and fix vehicle pollution. In the meantime, hundreds of millions of people in Asia and the far east continue to use two stroke powered light vehicles and motorcycles and no end in sight. We're all on the same globe, so why are the rules so completely different for vehicle pollution in different regions?

Because our politicians can.

Don't get me wrong, in my opinion everyone in the world should always try to create the least possible pollution and use the most efficient vehicles available, appropriate to their level of income. It's only sensible to try to minimise pollution. Individuals can do their best with that by using common sense and without spurious facts from politicians and pseudo scientists about climate change and political hand wringing/hysteria about pollution.

To keep on track with forum theme: I've reduced stack emissions on my IC models by lean burn tuning, and have reduced my coal usage by half by changing to gas firing on several models.

I feel better already, and am shopping for a green T shirt online. Can't find one that says "nuke the whales" anymore though....

I'm sure your motor is services as it is required its the idiots that don't service their vehicles that are the problem.

As for large ships they all have to be converted to run on Diesel as crude is to be banned or so i read somewhere

Ships are pretty much diesel already, but they burn cheap bunker oil rather than the stuff we get at the pump. Read all about the Wärtsilä-Sulzer RTA96-C engine; seriously grown-up - it weighs 2300 tons!

Dave

A curious side effect of the vast reduction of sulfur (Correct IUPAC spelling, unfortunately) pollution from Diesel engines and coal fired power stations is that arable farmers now have to use sulfur containing fertilizers to add it back to the soil.

Spent a few days in Devon earlier this week and had to smile when I saw a filling station that sold red diesel.

Mike

Clive,

Re Passat & hill climbing.

This was a while ago, perhaps 12 months so maybe I misunderstood him. I had 4 passengers in the petrol Avensis, and due to the way the slope works, I change up at two points where the slope slackens off. The first is from 3rd to 4th, and the second which is at 40mph was from 4th to 6th, missing out 5th. The rpm was about 1800rpm, I think, and it just slowly accelerated up the remaining slope. My friend with the Passat expressed surprise that it did it, from which I got the impression that maybe his wouldn't.

Having said that, I had noticed that he seldom seemed to use 6th. I don't know why, unless it's a hangover from an earlier car where he said outright that 6th was effectively an overdrive for motorway cruising. I'm one of those drivers who like to get up the box asap and when I found that my car was happy doing what it does, running at 40 in 6th, then I do it.

I don't think the Avensis is particularly low geared - 60mph in 6th appears to be around 2200rpm; rated power is at 4500 rpm hence equivalent to 124mph (not that I've ever been anywhere that speed). But it does give the impression of being a big(ish) lazy engine.

Peter G. Shaw

Interesting thought that somehow pollution at 36,000ft is less of an issue than ground level?

What goes up...usually ....eventually comes down...somewhere.

Anyone remember Cheynobyl & the eventual,result of radioactive Welsh sheep?

When last i checked,Airlines don't pay tax on fuel~ maybe it's time for them to start making an environmental contribution too?

There is nothing wrong with diesel engines per say, it's all down to how little the car makers want to spend on making the engine!

It seems to me that as most diesels seem to be turbocharged these days if the turbo is not spinning fast enough then power is lacking, once the turbo gets going then the power comes in and keeps coming, perhaps we will get some F1 technology and spin up the turbo with an electric motor to get thing started.

Mike

May I remind everyone that Hyundai are developing a Hydrogen fuelled engine which should beat everything else,

they are pollution free and there is no shortage of hydrogen.

Brian Bristoll.

There might be no shortage of hydrogen locked up as water, but as a free gas it doesn't occur in nature, you have to make it. Most of it is made by reacting steam and methane. This requires energy input, both to heat the methane and make the steam. What's left over is carbon dioxide, and when you burn the hydrogen, either in an IC engine or a fuel cell, you finish up with water. This means you start off with water and methane, and finish up with water and carbon dioxide. To my mind you might as well just burn the methane in an IC engine. I suppose that a fuel cell won't produce NOX, but is it as yet proven technology cheap enough for motor cars? In short, battery and hydrogen fuelled cars are not pollution free (unless they only use renewable energy to make the hydrogen/electricity), they just pump out the pollution somewhere else. Politicians seem too ill educated to work this out.
In case you think I'm being too negative, I've read that Germany uses excess wind power to generate hydrogen which they pump into the gas main. Considering that using gas for space heating is very efficient, that seems like not a bad idea to me.

Edited By duncan webster on 08/10/2017 16:02:32

I worry more about the population explosion that fuels everything else, how long can we keep up expanding?

Edited By Ian Hewson on 08/10/2017 17:21:49

Agreed but, short of a nuclear war or a plague, how can we control it?

Russell

Nuclear war! Plague! Come on Mr Trump, this is your point in history, the world needs saving from itself.

The QEII produced more pollution, consumed more fuel per passenger than Concorde.
BobH

What is it Donald trump says Diesels don't kill its Diesel drivers that kill or was it something about guns - It's all a blur

Lets just Nuke North Korea and be done with it !! (whoops Donald again, it's gone all blurred)

Climate change we don't have that in America - worst tornado's on record this year already