What direction should this forum be taking?

Mark, in light of the theme of this thread, could you take your discussion with Murray into another thread?

(I'm likely to get a kicking for posting this....lol...)

I think that what I value most about this forum is that I can ask questions and receive informed ideas. As a long retired person, that ability to ask and discuss is what I most miss from my working days. and occasionally I'm able to return the favour, not often I admit, but it has happened.

I do think it is beholden on all of us to be careful what we say and to not denigrate other peoples ideas and thoughts. Constructive suggestions yes, but not of the pooh-poohing kind. I'm actually reminded of something T D Walshaw (Tubal Cain) used to say, something along the lines of there being no single right way to do something in engineering. Which does mean that although your way may be easier, more accurate, whatever, it may not be any better than my way, especially when you don't know what tools and abilities I have at my disposal.

I don't find this forum difficult to navigate, and usually can find a back thread fairly easily by backtracking along the latests posts. I seldom bother with the different categories of entries unless I'm starting a new thread, and in any case there is a search function which can assist in finding whatever it is you want.

I have to say that I find it very easy to ignore those posts/threads which have no interest for me, eg anything to do with astronomy (!). On the other hand, the recent thread about motorcycles was interesting even though it's maybe 30 years since I owned one. Indeed, I did think about (but didn't) telling my brother about it as he does have a 750cc Bonneville dating from the 1970's.

So, my answer to Neil's original post - posters to stop knocking other peoples ideas, and to carry on as it is.

Regards,

Peter G. Shaw

The question asked was 'what direction should the forum be taking ?'

In my opinion at the moment the forum is attempting to appeal to everyone all of the time - it's becoming unwieldy and losing its direction by becoming too diverse.

I said in an other post I think the forum needs to decide what its target audience is and focus on that, as a few others have said other engineering forums are full of posts about builds / techniques / hints etc but here that core material gets lost in the reams of other chat.

At the moment there is really only 1 regular 'build' thread (although there are a few others updated less frequently) yet with all these members and other sites cramming in the build threads doesn't that in itself say something. ?

Others have said that the site shouldn't just appeal to the engine builders amongst us and I agree but I do also think it needs to be far more focussed on building (whether that be an engine or not) / tooling / techniques / ideas / technical discussions etc.

My worry is that before long the site will become a general discussion forum about anything by people who are otherwise interested in engineering.

Somebody earlier in the thread said you wouldn't last long in the 'Come dancing forum' talking about engines and that is a perfectly valid point.

Decide what the site is for, who your target market is then stick to it - if that means a far more focussed less diverse forum then you may get less postings but you will get far more 'quality' ones.

Edited By Peter Nichols on 13/11/2015 19:45:31

No you won't as it all depends on the members.

If you have a membership where they go out in the workshop and build things then you will get what you want.

If you have a membership where the biggest majority are welded to an armchair and Google then you will get what we have.

Possibly why the build forums like MEM get the members they have ?

Obviously it also involves contraband smuggling and tax fiddling so I can't tell you. But I can tell you it involved multiple forms of ID, endless forms, inside leg measurement etc. With things like credit checks you have little real visibility of what's happening - you just have to hope the decision is favourable. I seem to recall buying the house in Canada within a month of the family arriving with a minimum of hassle. Somewhat of a contrast...

That's precisely why I said you need to target your audience - decide who you want to attract then you'll get the appropriate memberships making the sort of posts you want.

Not rocket science is it ?

Again no.

On this forum we have a membership that runs into the 10's of thousands but it's always the same 35 ? people who post. Every forum is the same.

Those 35 people have already decided just how this forum will look as regards subjects.

.

Peter,

A quick reality-check, if I may:

The forum is "owned" by MTM and its advertisers and 'they' [quite reasonably] want to attract visitors who will spend money with them.

Think about it for a while, and you will see that there is NO particular 'sort of post' that they want.

[There are, of course, a few sorts of post that they do not want; but that's a different matter]

MichaelG.

Gentlemen,

I am a working engineer with a small workshop/garage, I am not a model engineer but I use my machines to help me restore/rebuild my petrol Stationary Engines which is my main hobby, I read this forum because it allows me to pick up Idea's of how to perform a task which can relate to the occasional job I have to perform on my engines. I was brought up on model engineering by my Grandfather who built steam powered ships and a traction engine so I can relate to those of you who do the same. I also enjoy the varied threads that occur, we all have hobbies away from making swarf and its interesting to read about the "Bee's" or the "Austin 7 rebuild" but what I don't like is the occasional back biting, bitching or general nastiness that can occasionally raise its head, I don't read everything, only that that interests me but then I assume others do as well.

The one thing that I see on other Forums I frequent is the occasional Troll which I'm please to see doesn't happen on here but I feel he wouldn't last long, keep the forum as it is as I think its about right.

Martin P

Michael,

I take your point about the commercial aspect but the point I'm trying to get across (and I did say it earlier) is decide what the forum is for, who it wants to attract then plan on that basis.

At the moment it's confused in supposedly being a hobby help / share ideas type of site yet commercial interests may want higher memberships who just want a general chit chat.

All I'm saying is what is the direction of the site ? Is it attract a smaller number of more serious posts or is it a glorified business where the quality of the material is secondary.

.

Yes

N.B, ... That answer is simple and honest, not cynical or sarcastic.

I am grateful for the forum, and the freedom to write pretty-much whatever I want.

But I am also realistic enough to understand why it exists.

MichaelG.

If people want build threads the answer is simple really. Start one. One person I am aware of on here did that as he was and in some ways still is a novice. He looks to have received plenty of help on his way to a model and then for some unknown reason deleted all or most of the photo's.

What it looks like to me is that if this site was purely build a steam engine threads no one would be posting at all really - especially now one seems to have come to a rather odd sort of end.

So if you engine people want them get of up of your backsides and start one and maintain it. A forum in real terms is only as good as it's members so if they wont nobody else is going to do it for you.

John

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i could not disagree with John Stevenson more! i always enjoy his entertaining posts except where he uses language i dont approve of, and have the greatest respect for his workshop skills. however JasonB has tried to set high standards as moderator, and is always extremely courteous and helpful and always model engineering related, whereas John is a bit too abrupt sometimes (and i know via personal correspondence his view of us in the miniature locomotive camp), and Neil seems to be floundering and lost his way.

JasonB could easily swamp threads with stuff about his excellent woodworking skills. he does not do so, much to his credit despite me having a strong interest in woodwork. it just isnt appropriate on this forum. neither does it behove Neil to swamp posts with his own non model engineering interests, and contributions to posts of which he clearly knows nothing about but cant seem to help himself wanting to see his name attached to a post in every thread.

a bit of restraint Neil wouldnt go amiss and would do much to help!

on one of the other 'specialised' forums of which i am rather grandly described as an 'Elder Statesman' the moderators do not need to restrain irrelevant and off topic contributions because there are very very few. in fact the moderators never post except very occasionally. we are there to discuss what we spend our precious free time doing in our workshops creating and operating stuff of which we are passionate about! we discuss improvements and details of design and performance, how to make particular parts on varied workshop equipment, (and lots of build threads) and we all get along fine and are all great friends!

i have the greatest affection for the ME magazine going back very many years but if this is it's flagship by way of a public forum then i despair sometimes!

cheers,

julian

John,

Where does this idea it's only for engine builders come from ?

A few people have said it more to do with how people build things / techniques used etc that is important not what the actual finished article is.

I'd be happy to read about anyones build work whether that's a steam engine, a part for a motorbike or a part for a telescope etc.

Edited By Peter Nichols on 13/11/2015 21:05:45

The thread title alone should be enough to make a model engineer weep...

As for the content, my wife just confiscated my belt and shoelaces.

Shocking.

If 'someone' decides a direction then what do they do? As JS said above it is the members who post who choose what they post about. You can't make post on the directed subject therefore all you can do is delete posts you don't like. The PM forum does that but it is not a popular attitude.

If this forum did become 'directed' to just build threads like some others apparently wouldn't we just have lost the diversity of choice. Lets have a variety to select the ones we like.

The whole Forum is a cornocupia of experience and knowledge and long may it be so! Ask for a technical insight and lo and behold it appears as people are interested in what you ask. There are so many facets to model and general engineering that you cannot steer a known path but you can direct it.

The Forum has sections and these break down to subjects other wise chaos will occur. The idea is not to make it too complicated.

Clive

Peter, the fact is anyone can come onto this site and seek help, offer advise, post build threads etc. on any ME related subject and get a satisfactory reply/feedback whatever to their particular input. It happens all day, every day and the hobby is richer for it. The general consensus of opinion does seem to imply that members like the way that the forum has evolved. Ok it can be a bit edgy at times but surely thats makes it much more interesting and real than a series of posts interspersed with loads of mutual "back patting" which seems to be the norm on some other sites.

John S is right in some respects that this is an armchair site although I wouldn't agree that most members are here in preference to being in their workshops actually making something. I use the site because I learn from it, I enjoy seeing other peoples solutions to a problem but also because I can get an insight into members other interests such as bee keeping, astronomy, aircraft etc. Reading these can often lead me off on a tangent of discovery and broadens my own scope of interests. Perhaps not surprisingly these "fringe" interests have still have some engineering/science based theme to them so I'm happy to accommodate or ignore them as I see fit. Were members to start interrupting the flow with discussions on politics, religion, sport and suchlike then I could sympathise with disgruntled comments and would doubtless express a disapproving point of view myself!

In conclusion I can't actually see what you would like to change, or indeed what needs changing other than a few tweeks such as more informative thread titles and separate dedicated areas for the "off topic" interests.

Martin.

I meant it in general terms Peter but do detect some interest in the direction I specifically mentioned.

It doesn't really matter what it's a build thread about really just that people need to produce them if they want them. Few do produce them. Bleating wont cause that to change,

John

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No, it isn't (rocket science). Have you considered that perhaps this is exactly what the people that run the site have done - to their satisfaction - and that perhaps you are the one that's out of step with that?