Lifting or hoisting a Myford Super 7

I have a little space in which to fit my Myford Super 7allowing for the headstick covers to be opened only 45 degrees and the tailstock close to a busy doorway, I also have a 2TON engine crane but have no idea where the lathe might balance or how to sling it.

If only these Myford's had lifting eyes.

Well first notes are that you don't ever put a rope round the chuck and lift it by that and of course it is going to be top heavy.
The balance point will be just to the right of the chuck on most lathes so put a sling round the bed there and be ready to move the saddle and tailstock to make it balance. Remember to lock both, firmly, and check again before it is more than 2 inches off the ground.
Now you need to protect the leadscrew from the force of the sling. On larger lathes it is often suggested to thread the sling inside the leadscrew but my preference on a tiny lathe is to block it out with bits of wood 3x2.
Next you need to handle the C of G aspect and stop the sling sliding down the bed. Put a rope through the spindle and tie it around the sling, then pull up snug to the spindle. This does not mean you are lifting the lathe by the spindle, you are just holding the top form tipping over with light force.
Still not ready to lift. One more rope is needed from the hook to the far end of the bed and arrange for that end to be just a little down which you can adjust by hand as you lift.

(I don't own a Myford and have never lifted one. My nearest equivalent experience is with my Drummond which is probably a little lighter)

ML 7 I can just lift up to my waist myself and put it where it need to be. It is just a bit over 100kg or so. Super 7 is a bit heavier but if you take off motor and tailstock it should be a piece of cake too.

You may ask someone to help as well. For 2 heathy men it is absolutely non issue.

Martin

Mmm, the reason i ask the question is I know there is going to be no room for two men at the headstock end where the lathe is to go and I want to avoid a panicked or failed lift, but suppose I could mount the lathe on the cabinet with space around it and then hoist both into place, if the cabinet doesn't put too much load on the mounts?

If you are reasonably fit you can do a lift, remove the motor and tail stock and it can be done one handed.

I last lifted my ml7 when I was 71, three years ago.

Two men it’s a doddle.

If you have space for a 2 ton engine hoist, can you not arrange something onto which you can lift your lathe. Then simply move it sideways to the stand?

[If you don't mind a comment that's not a direct response to your question as worded but rather of the "don't do it like that, do it like this" variety .... ]

Don't know how an S7 compares, but I moved my ML7 by removing excess weight (chuck, tailstock etc), running a trolley along side it then sliding one end of the lathe at a time onto the trolley. Used a small dolly to drag the stand into its new position (could probably have dragged it without the dolly) then reversed to process with the trolley.

The basic ML7 is not really that heavy - I couldn't lift it myself but it will slide with no problem.

(why is there an "e" in trolley but not in dolly?)

Edited By Bandersnatch on 31/03/2018 02:02:09

While engine hoists are very handy, sometimes they are not the best in confined spaces. The legs out in front sometimes get in the way.

I have successfully moved much larger items using pipe rollers on the floor. With a lathe, you may need to put it on a suitable sized piece of wood to do this. Once it is near where you want it, you can lift it using a pigsty of wood, so that you only have to lift the ends one at a time and slip a new piece of wood in. Once it is at the same height as the cabinet or stand, you can move each end across. Of course you need a lot of builders ends of wood to build a suitable pigsty. What I mean by a pigsty is a wooden structure built up with two pieces of wood in each direction alternating, so that a plan from above looks like a noughts and crosses game. For a lathe you probably want one at each end.

I actually prefer to avoid suspending loads where possible, if they are always over a sold support they can't fall far.

John

The other alternative , if you have enough room, three scaffold planks and slide it up into position.

If you have an engine lift, bolt a couple of plates to the bed, with 4 big nuts welded on for the rope.

I've moved my ML7 three times since I first installed it.

Removing it from and replacing it on its stand is affected by whether it's a peninsular location (accessible both front and rear) or against the wall with no rear access. With no rear access it seems best to avoid having to refit the motor - re-aligning the motor while leaning over the machine from the front is not a happy process! However, lifting with the motor fitted demands the right approach to avoid being taken by surprise.

What I'm leading up to is that the weight of the motor can suddenly try to take charge when the machine is halfway up the raising block studs. The machine tries to roll over towards the rear. This can bend the studs. If there's space for the lifter at the head-stock end to stand, they should stand end-on to the line of the bed (i.e. with their chest/stomach against the change-gear cover) but slightly to the rear, supporting the weight of the motor with their left hand. In my experience, lifting with the motor fitted and with both lifters in front of the machine stand is difficult.

Best regards,

Swarf, Mostly!

Edited By Swarf, Mostly! on 31/03/2018 09:01:59

Just done a S7B on a stand inside a really tiny dark shed with no room either end and a rotten wooden floor.

Had a friend to help but it was an absolute b*****d to do. Could not remove the motor pulley to get motor off so had to cut the belt and remove the entire rear casting, nuts solid and very hard to get at the last rounded off one under the motor. Even with tthat lot off it was still heavy going to get it into a rubber wheelbarrow!

100 feet on grass to the van!

Said wheelbarrow has now gone to the place where squashed wheelbarrows reside!

I think the gearbox and power xfeed saddle add a lot of weight in themselves.

I can do a bare ML7 on my own, not easy but doable!

Cheers, Martin

CJ,

If you can mount the lathe on the cabinet before final positioning ( and it sounds like you can) , then fit wheels to the cabinet first , wheel into place, wheels off, job done.

Adrian.

I've had some adventures lifting Myfords, including getting a Super 7 with gearbox stuck in the back of a very small Ford hatchback. As has been mentioned, the best trick is to remove the motor and tailstock. In my case, having a neighbour who was a super-fit martial arts champion helped too!

CJ,

Before trying to move it remove anything that is easily removable such as the chuck, tailstock, tool post and the motor (not quite so easy but worthwhile). This will take a surprising amount of weight off the machine.

Wear steel toe capped boots and put something soft below the lifting area just in case you drop it!

As Bazyle has advised never lift any lathe by the headstock spindle / chuck. Take your time and plan the lift.

Eric

Although it is just about possible for one man to lift a super7 you only get one back, having back pain for the rest of your life isn't worth it, and dropping the lathe would more than a little upsetting. If you hoist it onto the cabinet and then move it into place beware it is very back end heavy with the motor fitted.

I found that the height of the standard cabinet was far too low and finished up with some 6" square timber underneath. If you did this and made the packers reach right to the back (ie accommodating the motor overhang) it would be a lot more stable when being moved

Edited By duncan webster on 31/03/2018 11:33:28

CJ - Balance point and lifting demo (fully practical and done by 80 yr+ with knackered knee and back problems) ML7B - raised onto a couple of Lidl's finest 'pensioner's skateboards'!!

rgds

Bill (another CJ!)

PS - lifting strap was ex-Mil 5000 breaking strain tie down webbing.

B

PPS - crane was 1 ton engine hoist and assembly of THAT was the most difficult bit!

B

Edited By Cornish Jack on 31/03/2018 11:46:41

CJ2 was lucky to get away with that, it's a very unstable lift, nothing stopping it toppling towards or away from engine lift. If the lifting point is below the centre of gravity you need a 3 or 4 point lift. 2 straps splayed out so that you get a 4 point lift would have been much safer. Or move the single strap towards the headstock a bit and tie a bit of rope from the hook and round the tailstock end of the bed. Alternative lift each end separately and use the "piglet" as described above to get it onto the skateboards, then put bolts through the front mounting lugs to stop it toppling backwards. I reckon you could do that with a crowbar, no hoist required (apart from getting the lathe onto the stand)

I know it all sounds pedantic, but it doesn't take much more effort to do it safely, and the consequences of getting it wrong are high.

CJ, you want say whether you are moving just the machine or machine mounted on a cabinet ? I have moved mine several times plus assisted with others.

What I always do is use a steel plate cut to slide under the bed ways at the front with a hole to suit a bolt or lifting eye then if a lifting eye another plate on top of the bed ways so the eye passes through both and clamps them securely to the bed -- another way I/we have used a piece of 3 x 2 timber clamped on top of the bed long enough to make a lifting handle either side of the machine and 2 men can lift it easily. From what you say this would not work for you because of space restrictions.

Since you have the crane I would use the lifting eye method -- safe and easy, do of course balance the machine before lifting to full height.
John

My memories of lifting a ML7: (last time was 14 years ago)

The complete machine can be lifted pretty easily by two men, one at each end, BUT bear in mind that the motor REALLY unbalances it. It's one big ambition is to roll over so that the motor is underneath! So beware!

It is unwieldy, rather than too heavy.

If you have a fixed steady, you could clamp this, firmly, to the bed, near to the chuck, (Adjust position to balance, aided by positioning the Saddle and Tailstock) and sling it onto the crane from there

(MAKE SURE THAT NOTHING IS GOING TO SLIP, or Open UP!) And keep it steady to prevent it rolling over , motor down.

The suggestions for moving it (if on a stand) are good. As are the ones of bolting plates to the mounting feet, and using as sliders. If you sling from such plates, you are below the C of G, so thing will try hard to topple over!

There is a lot to be said for bolting to a pallet, or heavy timber, positioning it close to the final location, and then jacking and packing until it is high enough to slide into place, before removing the timber, and the steel plates.

Then, eventually, you will have the "joy" of taking any twist out of the bed. The ML7 bed is sufficiently flexible, that even changing the torque on a holding down nut will affect the twist. Resign yourself to many iterations before removing all twist! The raising blocks effectively allow you to do what I did with it's heavier successor. This sits on studs with a nut below and above each mounting foot. Careful adjustment will reduce the twist fairly quickly.

Then you can start to enjoy yourself!

Howard

Edit for fat fingers and typos

Edited By Howard Lewis on 31/03/2018 18:27:48