Scroll Saws Again
David Cambridge | 09/04/2017 07:50:16 |
252 forum posts 68 photos | Apologies to reawaken an old subject, which in the past does seem to have been thoroughly covered, but I’m still puzzled to the answer. I’d like to be able to cut out complicated shapes from brass, maybe 3mm to 4mm thick sheet, and I’ve been considered getting a scroll saw. Looking at the threads on this forum, and indeed other forums, it seems that that the consensus of opinion is that scoll saws aren’t the tool for the job. However, and that being said, whenever I watch ClickSprings videos he seems to use a scroll saw to great effect. For example, take a look at his first video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8Y146v8HxE I’m puzzled
David |
IanT | 09/04/2017 08:16:52 |
2147 forum posts 222 photos | Hi David, I think you've answered your own question. A (good) scroll saw can do this work but will not necessarily be the quickest way to do some cuts - and (in my case) I would assume the odd broken blade and a good deal of patience being required. So to a large extent the nature of the cut will decide what cutting tool is best to use. For straight cuts, a fine saw in the lathe or horizontal mill will be my go to. For some 'curving' cuts I have several jigsaws I use - a large one and much smaller Proxxon (which is very handy). But for "intricate" cuts then the scroll gets used - there is no real substitute (except perhaps milling) sometimes. You said "complicated" and that probably means that the scroll saw is the tool you need. A good quality one will help when doing this kind of work however - not your average cheap wood chopping machine. It might do it but your patience will get frayed... Regards,
IanT |
Bob Stevenson | 09/04/2017 08:43:14 |
579 forum posts 7 photos | After a lot of experimentation I have gone back to the humble piercing saw for intricate cuts......interestingly the scroll saw is no quicker than the piercing saw, takes the same blades and is less accurate. Not all scroll saws are up to the job of accurate brass sheet cutting and only a couple of makes are capable including the very expensive Hegner saws.....you have to be either a pro artisan or VERY serious about your work anyway!
............I have noticed that few artisan jewellers and silversmiths seem to use powered scroll saws,..they also seem to use the piercing saw It is interesting that this ancient tool is not only still around but has continued to be updated...see here;
http://www.cooksongold.com/Jewellery-Tools/Knew-Concept-3-Saw-Frame-prcode-997-3301?p=gs&gclid=CLeb187vltMCFa4K0wodZuIL_Q
As an aside; we have a new(ish) Hegner machine at Epping Forest Horology Club but it is not popular with members, indeed many dislike it and treat it with disdain! However, I have noticed that few tke the time to learn how to really set it up and learn how to get the best out of it before pronouncing it's inefficiency. Certainly, scroll saws like the Hegner are very blade sensitive and NOT straightforward for getting high quality results. Edited By Bob Stevenson on 09/04/2017 08:51:03 |
roy entwistle | 09/04/2017 09:27:43 |
1716 forum posts | Piercing saw every time for me Roy ( I find it very therapeutic ) |
Bazyle | 09/04/2017 09:49:55 |
![]() 6956 forum posts 229 photos | The problems with scroll saws are: Seems like a MEW design is needed, perhaps using the lathe (oh dear not yet another Myford only design) as the power source in order to get its range of speed control. A starting point might be a standard common cheapo Chinese machine and a series of article to rebuild it. Mine has been under the bench for decades waiting for attention to make it useable. |
Bob Stevenson | 09/04/2017 09:50:26 |
579 forum posts 7 photos | EDIT;.....just remembered this item with the great Ron Rose giving details of piercing saw expertise;
http://slbbhi.co.uk/?page_id=546 |
Cornish Jack | 09/04/2017 11:16:39 |
1228 forum posts 172 photos | Scroll saw versus piercing saw ?? Same as filing versus milling machine - 'you pays your money and takes your choice' The MAJOR item in the equation, however, is the blade. Well worth lashing out on the more expensive types. I think the last lot I bought were 'Flying Dutchman' or something similar - well regarded in the scroll saw brotherhood, I understand. rgds Bill |
Bob Stevenson | 09/04/2017 12:47:24 |
579 forum posts 7 photos | Bill....you are right about careful blade selection.....Ron Rose mentions in his article that he uses blades with a rounded back edge......
As regards filing/milling it's not the same consideration at all in my view..........a milling machine removes large amounts of metal but a £500 scroll saw takes just as long to cut brass sheet and does so less accurately than a piercing saw. |
Tractor man | 10/04/2017 07:31:55 |
426 forum posts 1 photos | Saw a cracking looking Meddings scroll saw at a tool dealers last week. Big old thing that looked very industrial. He initially asked 250 for it but would be open to.offers I guess. |
Tractor man | 10/04/2017 07:42:02 |
426 forum posts 1 photos | http://www.bwmachinetools.co.uk/details/meddings-scroll-saw-10929 This is a different dealer but looks the same model of saw. |
john carruthers | 10/04/2017 09:16:40 |
![]() 617 forum posts 180 photos | For the Dark Lady clock wheels in 3mm brass I used a jigsaw held upside down in a workmate with a scroll blade. |
Gordon W | 10/04/2017 09:36:50 |
2011 forum posts | John C- are you saying you used a mains power jigsaw, clamped in the workmate, with a standard scroll saw blade ? If so I would like to know more, and I'm sure a lot of others would, sounds an ideal solution. |
Russell Eberhardt | 10/04/2017 11:26:48 |
![]() 2785 forum posts 87 photos | Posted by Bazyle on 09/04/2017 09:49:55:
A starting point might be a standard common cheapo Chinese machine and a series of article to rebuild it. Mine has been under the bench for decades waiting for attention to make it useable. I bought an Aldi one about five years ago, tried it once and it walked all over the bench. Tried it clamped down firmly and still couldn't see the cutting point for vibration. Like yours it's been under the bench ever since. attempts at Improvements having been on the to-do list ever since. Found the best way to cut out complicated shapes in brass to be a cnc'd SX2 mill. Russell. Edited By Russell Eberhardt on 10/04/2017 11:28:35 |
john carruthers | 11/04/2017 08:15:02 |
![]() 617 forum posts 180 photos | Exactly that, not the safest procedure but it did half a dozen wheels cut from old brass printing plates 3.2mm thick. |
mechman48 | 11/04/2017 08:50:33 |
![]() 2947 forum posts 468 photos | Interesting info guys, I used a piercing saw for a flywheel, 3mm x 150mm aluminium, for one of my models, thought of getting a scroll saw but couldn't justify the expense at the time, reading you comments... still debateable ?... oddly enough was looking at the Chinese models in MMart last week ... vat free day offer...? |
roy entwistle | 11/04/2017 09:07:07 |
1716 forum posts | George. If you used a piercing saw on the flywheel as shown in the above photo, can I suggest that you don't clamp it down whilst doing it Roy |
mechman48 | 11/04/2017 09:23:29 |
![]() 2947 forum posts 468 photos | G.Posted by roy entwistle on 11/04/2017 09:07:07:
George. If you used a piercing saw on the flywheel as shown in the above photo, can I suggest that you don't clamp it down whilst doing it Roy
|
Neil Wyatt | 12/04/2017 21:33:05 |
![]() 19226 forum posts 749 photos 86 articles | My dad's got a MM one and swears by it, rather than at it, although he only does wood he has chopped a LOT of thick plywood with it making hull frames etc. Neil |
Mogens Kilde | 12/04/2017 21:45:35 |
60 forum posts 25 photos | Hello Folks Soon Neil will recieve my article on building a scroll saw attachment for a small lathe regards Mogens Edited By Mogens Kilde on 12/04/2017 21:46:22 |
richardandtracy | 13/04/2017 12:04:50 |
![]() 943 forum posts 10 photos | Posted by Tractor man on 10/04/2017 07:42:02:
http://www.bwmachinetools.co.uk/details/meddings-scroll-saw-10929 This is a different dealer but looks the same model of saw. I have one of them, converted it to single phase with a motor from JS. I have not used it as much as I wanted - it's a big old beast & bounces about a bit when running if not bolted down properly. To be honest, for precision, I'd never use it in preference to a piercing saw. However, they are good industrial machines & my one was used happily for at least 20 years at work before the woodwork shop had to be killed when pine sawdust became a Coshh 'toxin'. The profit on the woodwork shop was less than the cost of monitoring the air, so that was the end. And most of the machines, being quite elderly, were skipped. Regards, Richard. |
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