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What beginners model engine should I choose?

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Andrew Evans14/01/2011 23:04:02
366 forum posts
8 photos
Hello All

I would appreciate your opinions on what is the best first model engine (steam or IC) for a relative novice to build.

I have a pretty well equiped workshop with a milling machine and lathe and have been making various workshop tools (I just finished the George Thomas rotary table) so am not a total beginner. I do want to start a new project now and build either a steam or an IC engine. In the future I would like to progress to some of the more complex and larger IC engines.

I have looked at the Polly engine by Tubal Cain (the sheet metal work and soldering involved puts me off a bit I admit), Stuart Turner 10V and the Wyvern IC engine as sold by Hemmingways Kits. I would prefer to build something bigger if possible (rather than something very small and fiddly). Ideally I would want something where there is a detailed description of the build available.

Can anyone recommend a suitable project - I would really appreciate your ideas?

Andy
John Olsen15/01/2011 03:03:04
1294 forum posts
108 photos
1 articles
The important thing really is what you want to build. If you like the Stuart engines, they do have bigger ones than the 10V, so a bit less fiddly. If you are intending to progress towards IC engines, a hot air engine might be a reasonable choice, not least because you can have a self contained engine that runs without needing a boiler. You could find a stationary IC engines of a manageable size and not too demanding.
 
Really, the problem is not what to build, it is finding the time and money to build all the things that it would be nice to have a try at!
 
regards
John
Terryd15/01/2011 04:38:42
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1946 forum posts
179 photos
Hi Andrew,
 
A good place to start is here.  Lots of interesting stuff and free plans (which can be up scaled)  for you to browse with many different steam, stirling and i.c. engines.  Most need no castings which means less financial investment and more machining practice and time investment.  Best bit about the latter is that if you muck a component up you don't ruin expensive castings.
 
It's a good place to browse around and take time to look at all the possibilities before you decide.
 
Keep us up dated with your decisions and progress,
 
Best Regards,
 
Terry
Kieran Sparks15/01/2011 07:52:56
5 forum posts
Hello Andrew,
 
If you were inclined to build a steam engine similar to polly, i would suggest a Sweet Pea
Which is a Narrow gauge Bagnall style loco in 5" gauge. It has relatively few parts is easy to build and produces a fairly powerful engine which can do fair work.
 
Their is a build series book in paperback by Jack Buckler called "Build your own steam locomotives. It is upto date and the annotation and diagrams are easy to read, and the text is step by step. 
 
The main distributer is "Blackgates enginering" you can use them for as much or as little from full kit, to basic castings if you want to do it all your self.
 
There are many pictures on the net of these engines and nobody every speaks badly of them, they are proved and reliable engine. If you interested, always youtube "sweet pea rally" as there is one every year.
 
kind regards,
 
Kieran
 

 
 
 

 

JasonB15/01/2011 09:01:48
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25215 forum posts
3105 photos
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Kieran, think you have the wrong sort of polly, its not a loco, its a vertical boiler and small engine.
 
As said one of the larger stuart engines would be suitable, they mathods are very similar to the smaller 10V&H so you could use the build articles from these as a guide.
 
On the IC front the Wyvern is a fairly simple build and well documented, there are also a number of other hit & miss engines that can be built from barstock, Hamilton Upshur has several, Jerry Howell's "Farm Boy", Bob Shores, etc.
 
Have a llok at some of teh work in progress on HMEM this will give you an idea of whats about.
 
Jason
Andrew Evans15/01/2011 19:01:23
366 forum posts
8 photos
Many thanks for these ideas and advice - the John Tom site seems like a great resource.
 
Regards
Andy
Andrew Evans31/01/2011 23:02:27
366 forum posts
8 photos
I have started the Elmers number 25 wobbler engine! This is also covered in this great site http://start-model-engineering.co.uk.


Andy
Terryd31/01/2011 23:55:49
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1946 forum posts
179 photos
Hi Andrew,
 
great little engine to start with, Let us know how you get on with it. Start-models is a good site, full of encouraging ideas,
 
Best regards
 
Terry
Bill Dawes07/02/2011 13:25:42
605 forum posts
My first project was (and still is at the moment) the Jan Ridders simple 2 stroke engine.(free plans were in ME a couple of years ago)
I Have found it incorporates all sorts of skills, turning, milling, drilling, tapping, soldering etc and nearly all made from raw materials (ie no castings etc) I am not far off the end now and have found it an interesting project. My machine shop skills were learnt as an apprentice over 40 years ago and although my first thought on sticking in a bit of bar and doing some turning was that it only seemed like yesterday, I quickly realised that a lot of what I had forgotten was things like thinking ahead to get an efficient sequence of operations.
I have now bought a Stuart 10V kit ready to move on to my next project.
Bill D.
dixie07/02/2011 19:14:39
31 forum posts
Hello JasonB going off thread the link you put up to HMEM , when I clicked it on I was informed that I am banned from that forum, it even used my user name from this site ME/ MEW forum. any comments any one.
brian
JasonB07/02/2011 19:56:16
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25215 forum posts
3105 photos
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Try this instead, Think the link was assuming I was logged in, this should take you in as a guest
 
 
J
dixie07/02/2011 20:46:11
31 forum posts
Thanks Jason it still says "sorry dixie you are banned from useing this forum". Have tried registering but get same response. thanks again for trying, I can live without them.
Regards brian
Niloch07/02/2011 22:25:03
371 forum posts
Talking to Anthony Mount at a ME Exhibition about this very topic, he recommended this one.

Edited By Niloch on 07/02/2011 22:30:01

Andrew Evans11/02/2011 21:40:31
366 forum posts
8 photos
Many thanks for all the ideas.
 
Building the wobbler is going OK - one of the issues i have run into is that i need to be more accurate than in previous projects - so i have spent more time ensuring that the mill is accurately trammed etc. While doing that i have got side tracked onto making a couple of bits for the DTI and then frustratingly wrecking a little Verdict lever indicator by my own clumsiness with the milling machine - I won't be making that mistake again.
Anyway I have done the frame and cylinder now and i have enjoyed doing it ..... mostly

Andy
Richard Parsons13/02/2011 09:34:27
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645 forum posts
33 photos

Andrew Hi Whatever you choose to make you want something that is both quick and easy. Something which will run and do so without too much ferkeling about. I would suggest one of the Stuart oscillating engines, a Robinson Stirling engine (for which I think you can get the kit) which has the advantage it can be run on the dining room table to amuse the guests (without SWAMBO cutting up rough). Perhaps an Edgar T Westbury’s C.I. engine one of the latest offerings in M.E. like Jan Ridders 2 stroke which I would make for a glow plug.


What you do not want is to spend 5-10 years on one item before you see any results. On the whole I would go for a small 2 cylinder Stuart. They will run on compressed air and can look nice on the mantelpiece.

Andrew Evans28/04/2011 20:52:06
366 forum posts
8 photos
Hello All - The wobbler is now complete and runs first time (on a bicycle pump - will get a compressor or maybe make a boiler). Very satisfying, many thanks. Think I will try Bogstandards 'Paddleduck' next. Andy
Ian S C29/04/2011 10:15:05
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7468 forum posts
230 photos
Andy, I'v got a garden spray outfit, think it holds 5 L, and I can use that as a test compressor, although my biggest steam engine is a V twin wobbler, with a 6 mm bore and a 12 mm stroke, and smallest is a single with a3 mm bore and 6 mm stroke. One day I must put a pressure gauge on the pump, but it 's OK, saves starting the compressor, or hooking up a boiler then firing it up, messy things. Ian S C
jomac29/04/2011 10:31:48
113 forum posts

Andrew Hi. Have a look at the Modelenginenews (one word) site, there are IC engines plans and many pages on how to construct them, plus heaps of historical stuff, and other interesting items,the site is massive, it would take days to read everything in it, Join (for a fee) and you also get many more engines plans, plus pages of other goodies. and monthly updates.

John Holloway

Ian S C30/04/2011 11:50:33
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7468 forum posts
230 photos
When I was a 10 yr old dad taught me to solder, so the first thing I made was a little tin boat, must have been about 6" long or so, I had a few inches of 1/4" copper tube, so I wound a couple of turns of it round a broom stick, and took the two ends out the stern of my little boat, soldered it in , put a little bit of meths under the coil, and the boat moved. I showed dad, it was then that he told me about pop pop boats that he had when he was a boy, and learned that theres nothing new, but it got me going. o this day, I don't know where the idea came from! I still build my models from the same type of materials, designing as I go,"fraid I'm not into scale modeling. Ian S C

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