Dalboy | 02/06/2022 11:40:06 |
![]() 1009 forum posts 305 photos | If safety is a concern then change to a slow grinder with one of these WHEELS it eliminates the worry of grinding on the side of a normal grinding wheel |
Richard Kent 1 | 02/06/2022 11:44:20 |
53 forum posts 40 photos | Derek Lane - Derek, I did look at those diamond wheels. So far the Silicon Carbide wheel from ................................... has been performing fine. However, I have the choice of either upgrading or reinforcing my existing wheel. One way of doing that is to bond a plywood or aluminium disc to the opposite face of the grinding wheel with Epoxy Resin Adhesive. That way the wheel is unlikely to suffer any sudden fracture. I have also been improving my Ducking Skills so if that should happen the wheel should theoretically go over my head and miss me completely! R Edited By Richard Kent 1 on 02/06/2022 11:48:13 Edited By JasonB on 05/06/2022 18:37:55 |
Nicholas Farr | 02/06/2022 13:48:41 |
![]() 3988 forum posts 1799 photos | Hi Richard, I don't know how you can reinforce your grinding wheel by bonding anything to the opposite side of it when the flanges that grip the wheel with the blotters should be of equal diameter and have an equal bearing area. Regards Nick. |
Richard Kent 1 | 02/06/2022 14:28:51 |
53 forum posts 40 photos | Nicholas Farr - Nicolas, this is where too much reading and knowledge can be dangerous Bonding a reinforcing disc to one side of the wheel should not present any issues in theory. I'll let you know the results if I take that option. R |
SillyOldDuffer | 02/06/2022 15:33:32 |
10668 forum posts 2415 photos | Posted by Richard Kent 1 on 02/06/2022 14:28:51:
Nicholas Farr - Nicolas, this is where too much reading and knowledge can be dangerous Bonding a reinforcing disc to one side of the wheel should not present any issues in theory. I'll let you know the results if I take that option. R Too much reading and knowledge are never dangerous. It's getting stuff wrong in the workshop that causes real damage! Dave
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Richard Kent 1 | 02/06/2022 16:04:58 |
53 forum posts 40 photos | SillyOldDuffer - Dave, Don't take my flippant or sarcastic comments too seriously as they are not meant to insult. On a more serious note. Reading and knowledge is great but must be kept in context and balanced with alternative views. Example in this post: Grinding wheel manufactures advise against grinding on the side of a grinding wheel. So based on that information alone you would not do it. What I would recommend is that if anyone is going to do any engineering which deviates from the norms (including grinding on the side of a grinding wheel) then ensure you mitigate any risk with appropriate PPE etc. Regarding your quote: "Too much reading and knowledge are never dangerous. It's getting stuff wrong in the workshop that causes real damage!" Edited By Richard Kent 1 on 02/06/2022 16:23:00 |
Bezzer | 02/06/2022 16:11:11 |
203 forum posts 16 photos | Posted by Richard Kent 1 on 02/06/2022 14:28:51:
Nicholas Farr - Nicolas, this is where too much reading and knowledge can be dangerous Bonding a reinforcing disc to one side of the wheel should not present any issues in theory. I'll let you know the results if I take that option. R Perhaps you should do more reading and gain a bit of knowledge then. What is this "Theory" you are on about, all guidelines from manufacturers and training say to use equal flanges to give an equal clamping force, a wheel should be perfectly balanced for it's high r.p.m. or you are really asking for trouble. Bonding a piece of ply or alloy to one side is probably the worst bit of workshop practice I've heard. |
Richard Kent 1 | 02/06/2022 16:13:29 |
53 forum posts 40 photos | Bezzer - "Bonding a piece of ply or alloy to one side is probably the worst bit of workshop practice I've heard" This is NOT engineering advice so do not UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES follow what I do Edited By Richard Kent 1 on 02/06/2022 16:27:48 |
Bezzer | 02/06/2022 16:35:08 |
203 forum posts 16 photos | Posted by Richard Kent 1 on 02/06/2022 16:13:29:
Bezzer - "Bonding a piece of ply or alloy to one side is probably the worst bit of workshop practice I've heard" This is NOT engineering advice so do not UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES follow what I do Edited By Richard Kent 1 on 02/06/2022 16:27:48 I can't make my mind up if you are a troll or actually that far up yourself. Either way it doesn't matter as as the ignore button is about to be pressed , joining a few others I suspect. |
Clive Brown 1 | 02/06/2022 16:51:26 |
1050 forum posts 56 photos | I very occasionally use the side of my grinding wheels although I can fully see why the practice is frowned upon on safety grounds. But irrespective of this, surely a practical problem with regular use of the side of a wheel is the difficulty of regular dressing to maintain shape and cutting efficiency. Setting up a jig to routinely use the side of the wheel will run into this difficulty. Isn't this the type of job that cup wheels were invented for? They're all side! |
Richard Kent 1 | 02/06/2022 16:54:09 |
53 forum posts 40 photos | Posted by Clive Brown 1 on 02/06/2022 16:51:26:
I very occasionally use the side of my grinding wheels although I can fully see why the practice is frowned upon on safety grounds. But irrespective of this, surely a practical problem with regular use of the side of a wheel is the difficulty of regular dressing to maintain shape and cutting efficiency. Setting up a jig to routinely use the side of the wheel will run into this difficulty. Isn't this the type of job that cup wheels were invented for? They're all side!
Clive Brown 1 - Hi Clive, I was just showing it was possible to do with a standard bench grinder by following the Picador instructions. This is NOT engineering advice so do not UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES follow what I do |
blowlamp | 02/06/2022 17:10:03 |
![]() 1885 forum posts 111 photos | I must say I've never really understood the advice to not use the side of an abrasive wheel. It seems contradictory when you see some of the very fragile looking cup & saucer wheels that are made and intended for this very purpose.
Martin. |
Nicholas Farr | 02/06/2022 18:35:08 |
![]() 3988 forum posts 1799 photos | Hi Richard, if you wish to ignore established safety advice, that's up to you, providing no one else is involved while you are doing it. I can only give advice on what I've been trained and used in industry all my working life and the abrasive wheel courses that I've been on. Regards Nick. |
Richard Kent 1 | 02/06/2022 18:40:39 |
53 forum posts 40 photos | Nicholas Farr - Nick, see my disclaimer below................ This is NOT engineering advice so do not UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES follow what I do |
Mark Rand | 02/06/2022 19:00:16 |
1505 forum posts 56 photos | Deleted:- replying to a post over a page ago! Edited By Mark Rand on 02/06/2022 19:02:34 |
JasonB | 02/06/2022 20:06:22 |
![]() 25215 forum posts 3105 photos 1 articles | I suppose one should take into account how long ago those old Picador instructions were printed. Things have moved on a lot since then regarding health and safety, users should do too. The reason it is suggested not to use the side is that after prolonged use the outer edge will become undercut and likely to break away due to the rotational forces, bonding anything onto the opposite side is unlikely to do anything to reduce these forces. The lack of any side enclosure to the wheel on the grinder shown will also increase the risk of injury should the wheel fail. |
Richard Kent 1 | 02/06/2022 20:13:40 |
53 forum posts 40 photos | JasonB - Please see my disclaimer below............... This is NOT engineering advice so do not UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES follow what I do Edited By Richard Kent 1 on 02/06/2022 20:15:44 |
Clive Foster | 02/06/2022 20:56:04 |
3630 forum posts 128 photos | In reality there is little risk of an originally good wheel becoming dangerously undercut. These devices need a flat or near flat grinding surface to function. Any significant hollowing will destroy the sharpening geometry leading to loss of clearance angle at the outer edges so "sharpening" the drill will make little difference to its cutting prowess. The larger the drill the sooner the effect occurs. Long before the wheel becomes dangerous the "(obscenity delated) useless sharpener thing" will have been binned, pitched into orbit or relegated to the darkest, most spider infested, corner at the back of the cupboard. A barely noticeable hollowing of the side of the flat wheel I originally had on my grinder was sufficient to prevent proper sharpening of larger drills. Careful examination under magnification proved that there was no clearance at the outer ends of the cutting edges. I'd guess something significantly under 1/16" hollow would be enough to destroy all confidence. I fitted a 3/8" (ish) wide straight cup wheel and wide table perpendicular to the spindle, Hemingway Worden style., to my inexpensive Whitecolt grinder. Which made it far nicer to use for tool sharpening duties. The better visibility made it clear that the actual cutting circle travels sideways across the wheel as the Picador device swings. With 20/20 hindsight my cup wheel was barely wide enough to manage 1/2" drills. Had to do a bit of careful shuffling of pivot mount position to get it all working well. I suspect the Picador vertical pivot, 5 to 5 edge position, style has a rather greater shift of the cutting point during the swing than the alternative angled pivot, vertical edge position, style. Making it considerably more sensitive to wheel hollowing. But the Picador grind geometry is much more reliable over a range of drill sizes. Clive |
Vic | 02/06/2022 20:57:54 |
3453 forum posts 23 photos | I’ve got a belt grinder so I was thinking of trying this. |
Martin Kyte | 02/06/2022 22:31:56 |
![]() 3445 forum posts 62 photos | Our Lab workshop wheels are dressed to a taper on the side of the wheel for probably a couple of inches which not only addresses the issue of undercutting but generates a surface that runs true. The fact that the surface is slightly conical in form matter very little. regards Martin |
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