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Miniature gas torches

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Tony Martyr06/07/2011 14:12:53
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226 forum posts
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I am struggling to solder brass beading strips to the edges of 1.2mm brass sheet work.
I think I need a much finer flame that would allow me to 'tack' one end in place while working on the difficult curved sections with highly localised heat. My present burner just puts too much heat into the whole area and a have had not luck with a soldering iron because the brass sheet simply bleeds the heat away.I notice that B&Q have 'GoSystem Micro-Tech Pro Torch Kits' but I have no idea if they would do the job.Can someone advise me of the best tool/method for this sort of soldering task?Tony
Keith Long06/07/2011 14:40:58
883 forum posts
11 photos

I'd have thought a BIG soldering iron with a fairly fine tip so that the iron stays hot and puts heat where you want it. Otherwise tin the beading strip and the brass sheet where you want the join, clamp the beading in place and use your gas torch to heat them together and get a sweated joint. It sounds as though you need to pre-form the beading to follow the curve before you try and solder it together.

Keith

David Clark 106/07/2011 14:47:56
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3357 forum posts
112 photos
10 articles
Hi There
A temperature controlled soldering iron and low melt solder as used by railway modellers. Google Eileen's emporium for solder and liquid flux. Maplin or Squires of Bognor for soldering irons.
regards David
 
maurice bennie06/07/2011 15:38:35
164 forum posts
1 photos
HI Tony.
Try clamping the metal between two blocks of charcoal ,this will stop the heat escaping. start in the middle if pos and work to the ends . This is how I hard solder my silver jewellery bits together . If a long piece keep moving the insulation to cover what you have done. best of luck Maurice.
Pat06/07/2011 17:44:26
94 forum posts
1 photos
Hi Tony
 
I use stainless steel split pins as temporary clamps and a temperature controlled iron with an iron coated bit. (You do not file iron coated bits just give them a quick wipe on a damp cloth use fine resin cored solder.) You can use resist varnish to stop the solder flowing where you don't want it.
 
If you buy a temperature controlled iron there are two sorts those with a fixed temperature i.e. have a thermostat and those that have a variable temperature. The former are a lot cheaper when comparing similar quaities. I use the sort with a built in thermostat and use both 15 and 25 watt ones in preference to my variable temperature one that only gets used for repairs on PCBs with very fine tracks. Look for the sort that has iron coated bits and with the bit split to accept the heating element rather than the screw on sort. The screw on sort are difficult to change when the time comes and the screw cap gets in the way some times.
 
 
Unless you are going to use solders of different melting points there is no need for the adjustable temperature as to get a good solder flow the heat needs to flood the metal with sufficient heat to melt the solder smoothly. With the adjustable sort there is a tendency to try and solder with the bit temperature too low resulting in a dry joint or one that is weak.
 
Regards - Pat
Chris Trice06/07/2011 22:40:47
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1376 forum posts
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Use a small butane torch. Even a 100 watt pistol grip electric soldering iron will struggle to get the edge of the sheet up to temperature due to the heat being transmitted away. The idea of sweating the joints is good or you can use solder paste available from most model engineering suppliers. You want to get the local area up to temperature quickly rather than bleeding heat into the whole thing.
 
Alan Worland06/07/2011 23:01:05
247 forum posts
21 photos
I found the problem with a small but hot flame (I use oxygen and propane) is that it is very easy to over heat the work at which point it all gets mucked up and you get annoyed!
A large soldering is the way to go.
Gordon A06/07/2011 23:32:46
157 forum posts
4 photos
Hi Tony,
 
I use a cook's blowtorch for soldering jobs that require a bit of localised heat. It was meant to be used to caramelise the top of creme brulees and the like. Gives a narrow flame that can be finely controlled.
One of my pals has silver soldered small items with his.
 
I got mine from a well known low cost German supermarket, but they are available on the interweb. One site advertises them as a "Mini chef's blowtorch with automatic ignition".
 
Apparently not much use to average or large sized chefs though!
 
There is quite a range of models available on the web. May be cheaper and just as effective than the one you mentioned in your original post. Yer pays yer money and yer makes yer choice.
 
Regards,
Gordon.

Chris Trice07/07/2011 01:17:32
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1376 forum posts
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What Gordon said. You don't need anything that requires oxygen. Just a modest butane powered torch. Even a conventIonal blowtorch with a fine head and the gas only turned on halfway will get you there. I've just today finished fabricating a brass structure using 1.2mm brass sheet and I guarantee even a hefty electric soldering iron struggles with plate that thick unless it's relatively narrow strips. I was using exactly the kitchen type of butane torch mentioned. Once I get photobucket sorted, I'll post some photos demonstrating what I'm saying.
 
 
Sean Cullen07/07/2011 07:47:06
55 forum posts
11 photos
One tip I have seen elsewhere is to heat up the area with a hot air gun as used for stripping paint before applying your soldering iron or blow torch
 
Sean
AES07/07/2011 10:22:37
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85 forum posts
1 photos
Tony,
 
FWIW I'm afraid I disagree with those who recommend these "mini chef" gas torches (for use in soft soldering work let me stress) - IMHO the flame is far too hot and far too localised.
 
And let me also stress that not being a loco builder I have never tried soldering the sort of beading you're talking about.
 
But being an old-fashioned aeromodeller I HAVE done a lot of soft soldering with brass, copper, nickel silver, and tin plate, for fuel tanksw, etc, and sometimes using very small sections (e.g. team racer shut-off valves), and sometimes soldering onto "frigging big plates".
 
IMHO the very best you can use for this sort of work is a pair of those very old gas-stove irons (IF you have gas at home - unfortunately I don't). So my 2nd best ideal is a gas blowlamp of the Camping Gaz variety WITH the solder bit to fit (available separately). The iodea is simply to heat the bit and the flame itself is NOT brought into contact with the job (apart from a bit of leakage around the fitment for the soldering bit). That flame is far too hot for brass.
 
But please also note that even a 100-odd Watt electric iron will NOT do the job if the parent to which you're trying to solder is a substantial size.
 
Just as Maurice says above, you need some sort of insulator to stop the heat "leaking away" off the job and I've used off cuts of half inch ply, etc in the past.
 
That plus the use of railway modeller's low melting point solder and a good flux (I never use resin myself) and CLEANLINESS will make it dead easy after a bit of practice.
 
So there you are, that's what works for me - a completely different take to some of the above opinions so as always "ask 10 Model Engineers - I don't really qualify for that title BTW - and you'll get 12 differnent answers".
 
Good luck with it and hope the above helps. - as said, just what works for me
 
Krgds
AES
 
P.S. I find that either "Typex" (that white "paint" for correcting typing errors) or child's crayon rubbed onto the area where you do NOT want the solder saves a lot of cleaning up grief afterwards - another reason for keeping the temperature "down" to solder melting levels by using an iron , otherwise a direct flame would, I guess, burn the Typex or crayon off.
Phil Ashman07/07/2011 14:46:35
33 forum posts
Tony,
I always anneal the beading first, then you can bend it to the right shape without it springing all over the place. Then tin the beading and the surface it's being soldered to. I use small home made clamps to holdit in place, then solder with a micro-torch. The flame is hot enough to tack the beading in a few strategic places, without the heat being drawn away by the clamps.
 
To remove any excess solder, I use an unused HSS blank. If you push the flat part against the plate, the sharp corner will scrape away any solder between the edge of the beading and the plate. (Don't know if I've explained that very clearly!)
Phil
 
My torch came from B & Q, it's a Bernzomatic micro torch. I don't know if they still sell them though.

Edited By Phil Ashman on 07/07/2011 15:02:15

Stub Mandrel07/07/2011 20:24:38
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4318 forum posts
291 photos
1 articles
I have a 'chef blow torch' that cost about £8 from Aldi. Visually it is identical to ones sold for ebgineering use at about four times the price. The flame is highly contyrolable as you cfan adjust both the gas rate and the air, so a soft or fierce flame can be achieved, either cool yellow or harsh blue. Twenty minutes ago I silver soldered brass ends into a piece of 8mm brass tube to make a rudder tube for a boat using it.
 
For smaller tasks I use a turbo flame lighter, which is absolutely brilliant. I have used this to repair spectacle frames.
 
Neil
 
P.S. I should confess  I use superglue for beading...

Edited By Stub Mandrel on 07/07/2011 20:32:03

_Paul_07/07/2011 22:48:50
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543 forum posts
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I have never soldered beading strips but for fine soldering work requiring high but very localised heat I use one of these Iroda MicroJet
 
Regards
 
Paul

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