Storm in America

Joined up thinking + politician = oxymoron

Long term thinking + politician = oxymoron

Or to put it more concisely,

Politician = moron.

Until we get some technically competent politicians and civil servants we will not progress. Academic qualifications in Latin and ancient Greek are of less use than the famous chocolate tea pot. At least you could eat the teapot

Writing as a former (until sold off cheap) civil-servant, albeit of very modest level in the Scientific Civil Service.....

So many of them as know little or nowt about the Civil Service do so like to display that attribute.

Apologies to Nigel, I worked for the Queen as well for nearly 30

years. We had some very bright cookies, but were a wholly owned plc, not core civil service. I was referring to typical Whitehall generalists who seem to think they can manage anything without prior experience or knowledge.

Most politicians should not even be in charge of a wheelbarrow

NOx is a covering formula for Nitric Oxide (NO), Nitrogen Dioxide (NO2) and a few other short term oxides. These are produced by the combustion of nitrogen at high temperatures and in oxygen rich environments. Such conditions occur in gas turbines and diesel engines but not petrol engines. These gases oxidise to NO2 (the famous brown fumes) which kills you, usually by septic pneumonia from Nitric Acid in the lungs.

Nitrous Oxide (N2O) is completely different. It comes from the breakdown of some Nitrates and is almost harmless.

Pseudo experts have confused these two groups for over 50 years with various authorities that people turn to for information (Wikipedia amongst many) getting it wrong.

This has nothing directly to do with the Storm in America.

JA

Edited By JA on 28/12/2022 16:51:37

Edited By JA on 28/12/2022 16:54:21

Some people would have you believe they are 'experts'.

Before this thread gets too ‘Political’ … I would just mention that the edge of the storm has already reached the U.K.

MichaelG.

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https://meteoradar.co.uk/satellite-rainradar

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 29/12/2022 09:41:00

Covid highlighted how useless they really are

two years on full furlough pay and pension and no-one missed them, except for the passport and DVLA guys

The bin men stopped working for 7 days and it was total chaos

The civil service is like the clergy, 90% have no real useful purpose that makes a difference

People used to think Yes, MInister was a comedy, unaware it was in fact a documentary.

Post WW2 Britain has always had subsidised jobs to help spread wealth

The NHS is the best system, useful people getting real skills and doing useful stuff

The biggest transition was when they switched the money away from the working classes in the 1980s

people who dug coal and made steel were dumped and the cash went into subsidising middle class educated people who do nothing

Yes it seems to have passed over the US. Montana is now reporting temperatures around 38F above. So about a 70-degree temperature swing from the 30-35 below of a few days ago. Not just severe weather but severe weather swings as well. Such high temps were unheard of in winter when I lived there 30 years ago. Something must be going on causing all this extreme weather...

Ady -

Before you launch scurrilous attacks on anyone for their chosen profession, it is a good idea to understand what they really do, over what range of work at what range of skill and pay grades, in what range of departments, etc, and how widely around the country....

I don't blame people, I blame the system, a system which rewards people for zero useful outputs

Trouble is, there's no real definition of "Expert". It's usually an appellation used by the media for anyone from a local lab or college who will talk to them.

I remember the epidemiology expert in Toronto who told us at the start of CV19 that we had learned a lot from SARS and this new one wouldn't be too serious a problem. Didn't hear much from her after that.

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X is an unknown factor

Spurt is ‘a drip under pressure’

MichaelG.

Ady1 wants to believe a myth in which civil servants do nothing useful, so I doubt facts will change his mind! However, I'll try.

Reducing the size of the civil service has been all-party government policy for over 60 years, and today's civil service is much smaller than in the past. If Ady's opinion were correct, the reductions would have saved taxpayer money and resulted in the service improvements that some believe inevitably result from privatisation.

Unfortunately, neither happened! As the work being done was largely essential, functions and jobs were transferred out rather than cut. The taxpayer is still funding the work, and it's obvious that, on average, there was no improvement in services, or savings. The idea that cutting the civil service would fix anything has failed! The average Joe may assume functions are still being done by civil servants when - in fact - they're in the private sector.

My take is that simply applying gut-feel solutions to complex problems is always unlikely to deliver. Engineers don't work that way: we put considerable effort into understanding problems, don't pre-judge, and look at alternatives to find a good answer to the problem. Engineers consider it important to identify issues accurately and take an evidence based approach to remedial action. Engineers don't always get it right, but we know not taking a fact based approach in engineering wastes time and money and could be dangerous. Engineers put effort into learning and applying skills, have training, and understand the need for research when the facts aren't to hand. We work positively to become more expert, and aren't instantly convinced by ignorant know-alls telling us they know a better way.

Sadly gut-feel opinion sees no need to take a disciplined approach to solving the woes of the world. Humanity is prone to believe all manner of lazy fairy tales and half-truths rather than check and confirm. Wouldn't matter except implementing gut-feel ideas often inflicts unnecessary injustices on others whilst failing to deliver any benefits. Strangely, the perpetrators of gut-feel mistakes either don't notice or care that they messed up. When belief is more important than reality, the result is clumsy mismanagement, but I guess the sense of being empowered is what really matters, not achieving positive results.

Dave

Part of the theory, and it was only that, held by politicians by all parties was that selling the Civil Service would reduce the pensions burden but they ignored that -

- a) the new employers still had to pay them so added the pension-contributions cost to their contract fees; and

- b) on top of the overheads was a new component, a profit element not applicable in State ownership.

Worse, the governments allowed any old spivs anywhere in the world to buy the agencies. so just sending UK tax-payers' money abroad (the profits and dividends) and losing proper oversight and control.

The huge gold-plated pensions tale was a Press lie encouraged by politicians to help their case. The most you could ever gain in the Civil-Service Pension Scheme was half your final salary, only if you had completed a full forty years' service; and your pension is taxed above quite a low threshold. The number of civil-servants on high 5-figure salaries was never very large anyway because the vast majority of civil-servants were and are on quite ordinary administrative and technical work with commensurate pay. Many were on ordinary trade work and wages.

The Scientific Civil Service and academia, were particularly hard-hit because they are not generally in the public eye. So politicians found them an easy target in cuts that failed to understand the work's purpose and value to the nation, only its nominal running-costs.

Engineers? Yes, theCivil Service included very many, very good, dedicated Engineers and Scientists; but they too were all swept up in this gigantic failure as many Government agencies were engineering and scientific bodies.

The common myth of the Civil Service is that demonstrated by what Ady thinks it is: a vast army of administrators doing Nothing Useful on stratospheric pay, and all in Whitehall. A myth based on utter ignorance.

There have to be high-level Civil Servants in Whitehall, to liaise with and try to advise the Government, with each others' Departments and for some, with overseas Governments' representatives; but even if you include their support staff they are a tiny fraction of the Service as a whole.

The problem is that most politicians of all parties, and most journalists, are too idle to do what should be axiomatic for them: to understand broadly what most other professions, including the Civil Service, actually do.

Their knowledge of Science and Engineering even at basic lay level is abysmal, encouraging the common perceptions that the epitome of knowledge is being "tech-savvy" - i.e. nagging 'Alexa' to turn the TV on, not designing such instruments; of Engineers being washing-machine technicians on high call-out rates, and Scientists as arcane alchemists in white coats.

So they think, "What country needs engineers and scientists?" Or if we do need them, ask can these professional people get by on modest pay, poor employment security, the threat of being sold to some bunch of spivs in America or China; and perhaps worst, being accorded no understanding and respect.

Can we get back on topic? What is the situation now in the USA? is it coming over here as often happens a fortnight later? Some amazing photos of ice laden houses on the BBC website.

Email from a friend who lives in Chicago, quoted of night time temperatures of -30 F, which converts to about -34 C.

He says its cold, but now slowly improving.

Regards

Brian B

33F above in Butte, America, today. Almost motorcycling weather. About 12F above overnight.

Chicago is 50F above today, so downright tropical. The girls will be out in their shorts.

But that is an 80F swing in temperature in a few days. Part of the worldwide increase in extreme weather events and swings, hot and cold.

Edited By Hopper on 30/12/2022 12:41:35