Milling machines - western-made s/h recommendations up to £2k

"Large for their Capacity" I guess comes with the territory of older machines, huh?

Unfortuantely no Boxford milling machines available at the moment either - gosh, like real hens teeth!

As I said I think I'd be fairly satisfied with a separate drilling machine to go with the miller if I ended up with something without a quill head or much clearance - I can still centre drill the holes with a mill's precision and then go through on the drill press, right?

I guess the real issue may be that without lots of (how much?) clearance I'll run into trouble when using something like a rotary table or dividing head...

It's a shame that the Centec 2B's with a vertical head are more like £3k - the 2A from home machinery workshop seems in fair nick but is also missing some parts, a mismatched vertical head, etc. and is £2400. Are you saying though, that overall this might be a better choice than the Senior?

Good idea, except it's on ebay auction as a 'Buy Now for £1500' or 'Make an Offer' sale. So far no one has bought it or made an offer, suggesting no-one is interested. (Bet they are!) If I wanted it, sight unseen, I'd make a much lower offer and see what happens. It might just be rejected, or in the worst case it might trigger a bidding war by forcing other parties to join in. If no-one else wants it, might be got for a low price, or we might see the price go above 'Buy it Now'.

William mentions the cost of moving it, which has to be a consideration. DIY moving is cheapest provided the basics are available, perhaps a couple of fit-ish blokes able to dismantle and reassemble, plus a vehicle capable of taking the weight, with crane, rollers, ropes etc as necessary to get it on and off. My car is too small, and has a high boot lip, but an estate or decent trailer (weight and brakes!) would do it. The easiest way is to pay a mover*, who will have all the gear needed to do the job, the only problem is paying him! Delivery is one of the problems fixed by buying new: a nice man turns up in a big lorry, with a pallet truck, and rear lift. Ordinary delivery won't heave it through the house, across the garden and into a workshop, but I believe installation is available at extra cost £££.

Dave

* There is a machine mover who people often recommend. Can anyone remember who I mean?

William,

The Raglan is quite small and size wise in a different league to the others.

Rent a van for a day and save the interior of your poor old camper.

Landy Lift?

West Yorkshire though.

Edited By Dave Halford on 05/04/2021 10:57:01

Beware the 'professional' machine mover! I have seen some in action (in UK) - strops around handles, or anything that sticks out, seems common practice. Some are doubtless OK, but how do you tell?

It's all very well to get the massive beast moved, and dropped(!) at your front door, but what then? That's another reason why dismantling and moving it yourself is a good idea...

Edited By Kiwi Bloke on 05/04/2021 11:01:48

Maybe it would be a shout to ask the seller to show me it working, then assist disassembly at his location and loading into a rental van. I have a sack trolley and at my end it's a shallow sloping driveway and straight flat across paving into the future workshop.

I've nothing to lose on offering on the Senior so I think I'll do that. My previous worries about height are a little less concerning aftering seeing this screencapture, but am I well off-base with regard to using the mill to spot drill and a drill press to open out larger holes?

I guess there will be more of fixing things to the table to get that extra Z distance with this a machine like this rather than a pure vertical?

Cheers,

Lets put it this way. There no chance of me paying £1500 to fit a quill head on my Centec 2A and I'm pretty sure thats what the owner of the blue machine does. (use a bench drill)

Edited By Dave Halford on 05/04/2021 12:14:05

Is there not a current thread running re improving a Senior vertical clearance?

Just be patient and wait till you find an Omnimill (home workshop had one recently for £1600). They are rare but they are about and no you can't have mine! Verical head can go up to 3000 rpm, can be positioned anywhere over the table plus you have the horizontal spindle. If you get the morse taper version tooling can be swapped between spindles. Some people have mentioned the vertical head could do with more support, I haven't found that an issue personally but there are ways to address if you do. Very versatile machine.

Paul.

Thanks Paul - there is an omnimill on ebay for £1395 but doesn't have the original handwheels, horizontal milling arm, and seems to be generally a bit worse for wear...

A couple of Centecs advertised on another site. But ad was posted on 1st April......

For Sale: Centec model A and Model B milling machines

Thu 1st Apr '21

Advert ID: 39645

Machines (Large Tooling)
Used (Correct working)

Details:
I bought these 2 machines with the intent to rebuild them, but I have too many other projects to sort out, so they need to go. Both machines are 3ph, and came from a BSC research workshop. both machines have overarms and arbors, the 2B has power feed and a vertical head, and is on the Centec base unit. The 2A has a heavy steel bench for it, made of solid round bar so heavier than the miller. Both machines are bolted to pallets, so could be winched into a trailer or van. These are collection only. this site does not like the pictures I have so email for them.
The 2A is £300 and the 2B £650.

Terms:
Price: Multiple
Collection Only

Contact:
Chris Gunn
Kettering
nn15
UK
01536 482581

A non original hand wheel on the knee is a plus point. The original hand wheel for the knee was the same size as the others but that makes it very hard work raising and lowering the knee. Previous owners of mine fitted one about the twice the size and that was a real saviour when cutting the final drive gear of my half size traction engine! The bigger hand wheel made it much, much easier with over 70 teeth, there was a lot of handle winding! Nearly £1400 sounds optimistic in terms of price for a doggie one! I gave £800 for mine in 2017 I think it was, it's not pristine and has a few battle scars in the table but nothing drastic and a bit of wear but then it's almost as old as me! Still capable of turning out an accurate job though. HWM prices tend to be at the gold plated end of the scale so £1600 should get you a very nice one from a private sale.

Paul.

I'm hoping to find out a bit more about the Tom Senior (I've sent some questions) and the Omnimill on eb*y - but I see HMW also have a 2B with a horizontal arm and a vertical head listed - they have suggested £2200 delivered for the pair - does that feel about right for the money?

If that Centec 2B advert above is genuine and not an April Fools joke, then £650 sounds to be a real bargain.

Phil

It does say they were bought as projects to rebuild, depends if William is willing and able to do whatever may be required to get it upto usable condition.

£2200 sounds a bit rich for me! Centec's are good machines I believe but I have never had one. I believe from what I have read they are improved by a riser block. My personal choice from the two is the one for £650 even if it needs a bit of work you won't go wrong if you have the skills. For £2200 you can have a new Warco I believe ready to rock with a year's warranty!

Paul.

The £650 one is gone unfortunately

William, you've not told us if you have the mechanical abilities to refurb an old machine, you could get a new warco vmc for £2150.

Well I think for £650 I'd be happy to learn as I went - I'd like to think I'm mechanically inclined but the majority of my experience so far has been on my old MGB car and my Myford ML7.

I'm really just not sure about a far east machine as per the main premise of this thread but for the sake of completeness how would a Warco VMC (or equivalently priced mill £1500-2000) match up against the Bridgeport Series I, Tom Senior, Omninill, Centec 2B, etc. ?

Edited By William Ayerst on 05/04/2021 22:13:26

When you said that omnimill on ebay wasn't very good condition, it just gave me the impression your expectations for an old machine costing £1200 were maybe unrealistic, I thought it was pretty good condition, far better than something with paint sloshed over it, making it look good from a distance, you wouldn't believe how some people paint things without properly disassembling, painting over nuts, bolts, screws, might look good in an eBay pic, in reality just extra work scraping it all off.

Warco vmc is comparable to your list in size, apart from the Bridgeport, I thought you ruled that out?

Moving a big machine like that will cost £400-£700 of you budget depending on distance.