Workshop Clock

If you want battery life you need to go digital (LCD), I've had one of these for some years and can't remember when I last put batteries in it. It updates by reference to an atomic clock although this particular one can't do that in Europe. Marathon sells in Europe though so I imagine they have a version that works there.

Easy on the eyes - 4'' display - and corrects for DST as appropriate. Also gives temperature and humidity which can be handy in the workshop. Didn't cost an arm or leg (or both) either.

Afterthought: if you don't like digital clocks there are, of course LCD "analogue" clocks which should also give long battery life.

Edited By Peter Greene 🇨🇦 on 05/07/2023 19:25:23

Hi John, doubt it is over engineered, the old mains clocks keep their time by the mains frequency, and a small difference or variation of voltage will make no difference to the time keeping. If you run it on 60Hz instead of 50Hz, it would run fast, but if it's a 60Hz one and you run it on 50Hz, it would run slow.

Regards Nick.

As I reported earlier a workshop may not be a good place for sensitive electronics where periods of high humidity, combined with flux residue left on a PCB after manufacture may cause corrosion or leakage. My DRO readout head recently suffered from this but about 5 years ago a microprocessor based device, located in my garage, that is used by my solar panels failed. Close inspection revealed that the 32khz crystal, associated capacitors and tracking to the microprocessor showed signs of corrosion. Cleaning this off and varnishing the area has cured the issue.

Most digital clocks use CMOS integrated circuit and a 32khz crystal oscillator circuit where even microamps of leakage current will affect their operation and may reduce battery life.

What I have found is that the effect of acidic flux residue, humidity and the device power causes tin to migrate out of the solder to "plate" the PCB which is easy to see under a microscope. Once this happens only physical scrubbing can remove the plating and restore correct performance.

CS

Forget the AA cell, wire it up to a D size and it will run for years.

You could do something a bit different! sorry about the sideways image

Thanks to all for useful (and occasionally entertaining) replies.

Currently, I have a (cheap) fitness watch so I can check the time, but it's been many years since I wore a real wristwatch and the habit has left me. There's less of an effort to look up at a clock than turn the wrist and tap on the modern thing. especially wearing an overall which hides it!

I suspect that the mechanism in an expensive analogue wall clock (atomic and radio apart) is quite likely to be the same as that in the cheapest. The price appears to be dependent on garnishing not functionality. I may be wrong, but have no interest in spending 50 quid and more to find the same issue.

I am firstly, not disciplined enough to wind up a mechanical clock reliably and secondly I am not necessarily in the shed consistently enough to make this a reliable form of timekeeping. Sadly - it would be more in keeping with my interests. Though I do have a clock on my todo list, it's some way off.

I think my solution is going to be to buy a mains powered digital wall clock like this or this. No moving parts, good visibility and should be accurate and reasonably resistant to shed vapours (the clock is high up and unlikely to get spilled on or splashed). I'm slightly favouring the one with the thermometer as I like to know how much I'm suffering in Summer and Winter!

Probably won't be buying this till later in the month as I have grossly overspent the shed budget already and will be in trouble from the boss....

Thanks again

Iain

I'm a bit baffled by the problem Iain is having with clocks, mine has had the same single AA battery for 2 years or more and it's still going, in fact I didn't bother altering it in the Autumn when we put back the hour so it came right again in the Spring  I should add that it keeps perfect time as well

Edited By vic newey on 06/07/2023 12:11:34

We've got a bog standard quartz clock outside at our ME club. Summer and winter. Batteries last a reasonable time, not quantified, but we're certainly not forever changing them

I've worked out that mine, pictured above is probably 25+ years old, it fell off the wall when re-arranging my shed a few years ago and hence the crude masking tape and wood strips repair, the current battery is a Panasonic

Quartz clock crystals slowly change their frequency of oscillation over time, as they age. Good ones change very slowly indeed, while I imagine cheap ones in cheap movements age more rapidly. The ultra-cheap quartz movements sold on various well known sites provide the kind of quality commensurate with their price. The much more expensive ones you will find in the few remaining clock parts suppliers to the trade (and ordinary punters) tend to follow the usual YGWYPF rule.

It is possible to correct the rate of oscillation, but not worth while in a cheap clock.

Like others, I use a radio controlled clock, when I am not looking at the computer clock which is set to sync with a time server over the internet.

When I was at work, we had a number of radio studios, and each had a radio controlled clock. before I retired, we moved to a fabulously expensive new purpose-built building which had 8 new radio studios. The plan was to run a GPS receiver which fed a time signal to a clock in each studio, so that they were all synchronised. Sadly, the builders sealed the only access channel up to the roof (GPS aerials need to see the satellites), so we had to revert to individual radio controlled clocks. Unfortunately, the studios were on the ground floor, and had thick walls with no external windows, and no way for the weak-as-water radio signal from the German time station, so the nice R/C clocks had a really hard time (but perhaps not so hard as the Presenters and Newsreaders).

Marcus

Hi Lian

had the same problem put clock in bar in garden

changed batteries every couple of month not sure

why it just kept stopping got sick in the end put

it in the bin

then again I’ve had a cheap clock on the wall

in my back garden out in all weather change the battery

once a year and it’s still going after 4 years

Steve

I suspect, sadly, that the ever present pressure to make more profit is "forcing" manufacturers to make things ever more cheaply.

Sourcing a cheap clock from the internet has no guarantee of being well made. It will be made down to a price, and it is pot luck really whether the one you get will have reasonable performance or not.

Clocks made, perhaps 20 years ago - even the cheap ones - were probably better designed and built - with better bearings for example - than they are now?

This is a clock related issue, in the 60’s my wife was given a wedding present by the girls she worked with, it was a handsome looking mantelpiece clock with a lovely highly polished wood case. Said clock performed brilliantly for a good number of years, it was an excellent time keeper, suddenly one day stopped working so I dismantled it to find the problem. Inside the case where one of the driving wheels should have been was a neat pile of black dust. It appeared that the manufacturer had used what was then a revolutionary material in its construction, carbon fibre. Apparently when first used carbon fibre had a tendency to a short life before the structure would disintegrate, something only found out when early components manufactured from it failed in service. Has always made me sceptical about aircraft components made from carbon fibre and enough said about deep sea submersibles. Dave W

I'm afraid the 'better in the past' perception is mostly an age thing John. Old men have ended up convinced the world is going to the dogs throughout history. Actually it's us who are in decline.

The general thrust of technology is upward. Better understanding of materials and improved techniques mean modern industry routinely makes stuff that was impossible 20 years ago.

The benefit isn't always improved 'quality'. I believe it was George Stephenson who said 'An engineer is a man who can do for a pound what any fool can do for a guinea.' Cost control has always been a top-priority in engineering because although customers burble nonsense about the importance of 'quality', they're extremely reluctant to pay for it! So professional engineers have to target what people will actually pay for with products that are 'good enough' and 'value for money'.

Sadly there's a huge difference between what most people say they want, and what they actually buy. It's because many things in life compete for our time and money. Most people, most of the time, buy the cheapest that does the job, not the best available. The best is expensive. You can't just pile on 'quality' and expect it to sell

Clocks are a good example of mixed results. Quartz movements consist of an accurate crystal oscillator, an electronic divider, and a simple motor and gear-train. The gears are plastic. The divider contains several hundred transistors, that before 1960, would have filled a 19" equipment rack with unreliable valves and cost as much as new car. The crystal is high-tech synthetic quartz, grown and cut in a specific way, and only cheap because they're mass-produced in billions. The movements are reliable without special bearings, and normally last at least 5 years. Apart from an occasional new battery, zero maintenance; replace on failure. In terms of accuracy, they beat most mechanical clocks hollow. For most purposes they are 'good enough', and more reliable in the short and medium term. But they will never become family heirlooms!

The bearings in an ordinary cheap clock are 'fit for purpose', not the best modern industry can do. Computer hard-drive bearings are considerably more impressive - take one apart! Hard drive technology is well beyond anything that could be made with a Myford, or by anyone in the world in the 20th Century, and now they cost as little as £15.

Alas and alack, old simplicities have gone . Brand-names are untrustworthy, and cost isn't a sure fire indicator of quality.

Disposable goods were enthusiastically adopted by Boomers. We are all guilty. Not a good thing in my opinion, because disposable isn't sustainable in the long run. It will have to change and grandad will hate it, because it will cost him money!

Dave

Hi Dave, SoD.

It is certainly true that technology moves on and generally improves year on year. However, this thread started with an example of a 'modern' product that actually did not perform very well, and stopped working, but we all know of products from years back, which have lasted a much longer time. Washing machines and gas boilers for example used to last 20+ years easily, but now often seem to break down after a just a few years.

What needs to be borne in mind is that the profit motive also moves on, and manufacturers and producers are constantly trying to increase their profits and returns - witness the proposed closure of ticket offices on most railway stations.

Light bulbs too, used to last a very long time until light bulb manufacturers realised that their profits were drying up; so they reduced the raw material and manufacturing standards so that light bulbs did not last anything like as long - planned obsolescence was invented and the throw-away society was created. Smart phones and lap-tops are only supported for about 5 years, after which updates are not published for them and they become not secure to use - more planned obsolescence.