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Dave Halford14/04/2022 11:52:12
2536 forum posts
24 photos

Prevention is better than a cure.

We roast tomatoes in a casserole dish with the lid on, that way you get more juice to pour on your plate where it belongs.

Ps

As the forum Subject Police have not yet attended this party and in the interests of balance.

What's this got to do with Model Engineering?????

BC Prof14/04/2022 12:23:45
182 forum posts
1 photos

it's Ideal to[pic for the tea room .

Brian

larry phelan 114/04/2022 12:28:07
1346 forum posts
15 photos

Good man Duncan !, could not have put it better myself !!

My cooking is so bad that it would make no difference anyway, so why bother.cheeky

Michael Gilligan14/04/2022 12:59:42
avatar
23121 forum posts
1360 photos
Posted by Dave Halford on 14/04/2022 11:52:12:

Prevention is better than a cure.

We roast tomatoes in a casserole dish with the lid on, that way you get more juice to pour on your plate where it belongs.

Ps

As the forum Subject Police have not yet attended this party and in the interests of balance.

What's this got to do with Model Engineering?????

.

Given the digressions … bugger all

The actual question was to do with Chemistry and was, I believe, put in an appropriate topic.

MichaelG.

Michael Gilligan14/04/2022 13:01:27
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23121 forum posts
1360 photos
Posted by BC Prof on 14/04/2022 12:23:45:

it's Ideal to[pic for the tea room .

Brian

.

Perhaps it is … now

[ please note my response to Dave Halford ]

MichaelG.

Grindstone Cowboy14/04/2022 14:52:22
1160 forum posts
73 photos
Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 14/04/2022 09:44:50:

Anyone tried Isopropyl alcohol? Apart from the cost, fumes, and fire hazard I think it might work well. Ditto petrol...

devil

Dave

Tried IPA, didn't work as well as expected. indecision

Rob

Robin Graham15/04/2022 00:23:56
1089 forum posts
345 photos
Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 14/04/2022 09:44:50:
Posted by Robin Graham on 14/04/2022 01:01:26:
Posted by Michael Gilligan on 13/04/2022 19:33:38:

Thanks to Dave and Thor … I am reminded of a previous thread on this forum, about micro-bubbles generated in canine toothpaste.

I am happy to believe that the underlying process is generally similar.

MichaelG.

.

Ref. **LINK**

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 13/04/2022 19:36:14

...

On the chemistry front I'm pretty skeptical about claims that vinegar 'attacks' grease in a chemical way. It's certainly true that grease can be broken down by dilute acid (acid hydrolysis of esters), but I doubt that the reaction is significant in cleaning an oven. Possibly it has some mild solvent action?

...

That's what I was hinting at when I said the answer was as much to do with physics as chemistry. Dilute Acetic Acid isn't like Caustic Soda, which attacks fats aggressively; Vinegar only has a mild dissolving effect. Simply splashing vinegar on a dirty oven won't get it clean. It's important that the Bicarbonate / Acid mix be a paste, in which the Bicarbonate and Acid are slowly reacting to produce micro-bubbles, AND there are plenty of sharp Bicarbonate crystals to act as an Abrasive, AND there's enough fluid to penetrate tiny cracks and crevices, AND the paste is rubbed in enthusiastically by the operator. Works in much the same way as soapy Brillo-pad, except the Brillo pad abrades with steel-wool, soap breaks up the fat and there are no micro-bubbles.

Cleaning an oven with a solution of Sodium Acetate made by carefully neutralising Sodium Bicarbonate with Vinegar is a waste of time. It's not reactive or abrasive and there are no micro-bubbles.

Caustic Soda paste, made with water, can be splashed on and left. The alkali breaks fats up, so the operator can leave the oven to soak and wash the whole lot off with water a few hours later. Sodium Bicarbonate would do the same but take a lot longer.

Anyone tried Isopropyl alcohol? Apart from the cost, fumes, and fire hazard I think it might work well. Ditto petrol...

devil

Dave

Apologies for not referring to your post directly Dave - I think you nailed it when you said it is as much to do with physics as chemistry, Perhaps even 'more' rather than 'as much'? As Michael had asked for an explanation of the chemistry I was attempting to give some background as to why a chemical explanation doesn't work by referring to the chemical basis (ester hydrolysis) for fat breakdown by the individual components of the mixture.

IPA is good for many things, but being a polar solvent isn't great for grease, as Grindstone Cowboy found. Ideally one would use dichloromethane or chloroform for pure solvent action, or a solution of sodium dichromate in

concentrated sulphuric acid for pure chemical action. wink

I'm not sure how one would make a paste of caustic soda in water? Sounds a bit dangerous...

Robin

Mark Rand15/04/2022 10:25:41
1505 forum posts
56 photos
Posted by Robin Graham on 15/04/2022 00:23:56:

I'm not sure how one would make a paste of caustic soda in water? Sounds a bit dangerous...

Robin

Isn't that what morern paint strippers are?

Of course, the ones that actually work still have dichloromethane as a major constituent. Hadn't thought to use one as an oven cleaner though. devil

Bazyle15/04/2022 15:26:39
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6956 forum posts
229 photos

Given that ovens are used at >100c which will kill all microbes why clean it anyway? Unless you are using it for its proper purpose, ie baking enamel paint then I can see the need to ensure there are no sources of smuts laugh

An Other15/04/2022 17:14:47
327 forum posts
1 photos

I've always found the most efficient method is to let the wife do it (she is usually the one that makes it dirty anyway)cheeky

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