RICHARD GREEN 2 | 26/01/2017 17:07:32 |
329 forum posts 193 photos | I've got a 600 sq / ft commercial machine shop, and it's cold ! I have tried in the past a propane space heater , it warms up nicely, but the fumes give me a headache, My friend has a larger building and he uses a diesel / kerosene space heater, and he says the fumes are no problem, What does anyone think ? Richard. |
pgk pgk | 26/01/2017 17:20:43 |
2661 forum posts 294 photos | I bought a modest 22kw Draper space heater to run on red and allow me to do stuff in my draughty barn. It worked for a week before dying.. got returned and repaired, worked for 2 days.. got returned and claimed no fault found.. worked for a day.... finally I gave up.. If you're actually commercial and make a reasonable living at it then I'd say go for a 6-8KW reverse flow aircon system..inverter motors make them quite economical to run, you get the extra benefit of the ocassional hot summer, reasonably quietand if it's Daikin brand then a fair chance you can get away with not botherng to service it often (or at all) |
MW | 26/01/2017 18:15:04 |
![]() 2052 forum posts 56 photos | With gas heaters you need to have some decent ventilation, like a wall bracket type fan to the outdoors. They are still worth it as the cost of electric heaters can be horrendous over continuous use. My old boss used them(a 3 phase type element heater) 9-5 and incurred a £1k bill over a winter month. Michael W
Edited By Michael-w on 26/01/2017 18:20:02 |
Nick Hulme | 26/01/2017 19:12:14 |
750 forum posts 37 photos | Get a workshop gas heater, the combustion products run inside a heat exchanger and out through a chimney, a fan circulates shop air over the heat exchanger, if you fit it close to floor level the chimney will also radiate/convect heat into the shop like a wood stove chimney. Serious insulation and draught proofing might be a more economic long term solution and can help keep a workshop cooler in summer too,
- Nick |
pgk pgk | 26/01/2017 19:36:05 |
2661 forum posts 294 photos | I have a 6kw euqiv daikin in the livingroom and a 3kw in the main bedroom. When they were installed i questioned the slender wire going to the outdoor units.. didn't look thick enough to run anything. Fitter put a meter on the 6kw equivalent thing when it was running the draw was tiny... I'm sure daikin would give exact figures. |
mgnbuk | 26/01/2017 19:38:48 |
1394 forum posts 103 photos | We use a couple of SIP Fireball diesel space heaters to warm a (bigger than yours) workshop at work. The larger of the two is rated at 52Kw & it really belts out the heat, but uses around 5 litres of red diesel per hour - the smaler one is about 15Kw & uses about 2 litres an hour. We have a diesel tank on site though (as we make our own electricity via a 200kva generator) so have no shortahe of the red stuff - I modded a 205 litre oil drum to have hose & valve that lives inside the works to fill the heaters & use a barrel full a week at the moment. The only time it smells is if it is allowed to run out (when there is a cloud of vapourised, non-combusted diesel fumes) and after switching off (when it just whiffs a bit "dieselly" I have not had any comments about my collegues feeling unwell due to fumes in the main workshop, though the workshop doors get opened during the day to get in & out with a FLT. The smaller heater was bought for a smaller workshop & the chap working there stopped using it after a while as he was getting headaches & attributed these to the heater fumes. They can be finicky to keep running & are not maintenance free - there is a small compressor mounted on the rear of the fan motor that blows air through what looks very like a spray gun nozzle in the combustion chamber - this what draws the fuel from the tank & generates the fuel/air mix that is ignited by a continuous spark between two electrodes. There are a couple of filters to clean on the compressor inlet & the spark electrodes can short out through dust contamination (though that may be more due to our graphite machining environment & may not apply to you !). HTH Nigel B |
vintagengineer | 26/01/2017 21:11:04 |
![]() 469 forum posts 6 photos | You not using the heat from the generator? Posted by Nigel B on 26/01/2017 19:38:48:
We use a couple of SIP Fireball diesel space heaters to warm a (bigger than yours) workshop at work. The larger of the two is rated at 52Kw & it really belts out the heat, but uses around 5 litres of red diesel per hour - the smaler one is about 15Kw & uses about 2 litres an hour. We have a diesel tank on site though (as we make our own electricity via a 200kva generator) so have no shortahe of the red stuff - I modded a 205 litre oil drum to have hose & valve that lives inside the works to fill the heaters & use a barrel full a week at the moment. The only time it smells is if it is allowed to run out (when there is a cloud of vapourised, non-combusted diesel fumes) and after switching off (when it just whiffs a bit "dieselly" I have not had any comments about my collegues feeling unwell due to fumes in the main workshop, though the workshop doors get opened during the day to get in & out with a FLT. The smaller heater was bought for a smaller workshop & the chap working there stopped using it after a while as he was getting headaches & attributed these to the heater fumes. They can be finicky to keep running & are not maintenance free - there is a small compressor mounted on the rear of the fan motor that blows air through what looks very like a spray gun nozzle in the combustion chamber - this what draws the fuel from the tank & generates the fuel/air mix that is ignited by a continuous spark between two electrodes. There are a couple of filters to clean on the compressor inlet & the spark electrodes can short out through dust contamination (though that may be more due to our graphite machining environment & may not apply to you !). HTH Nigel B
|
Nick Hulme | 26/01/2017 21:30:57 |
750 forum posts 37 photos | Waste heat is so often wasted |
vintagengineer | 27/01/2017 09:24:19 |
![]() 469 forum posts 6 photos | Our local water works has 3 cathedral ships engines to run generators. They only run 2 at a time and in the winter they ruk.n the cooling water through the office radiators and get free heating for the office block. |
Ian S C | 27/01/2017 09:48:21 |
![]() 7468 forum posts 230 photos | Nigel B, the generator could probably supply much of the heat for the workshop by directing the air from the cooling system, be it a radiator, or an air cooled system. Ian S C |
mgnbuk | 27/01/2017 13:22:42 |
1394 forum posts 103 photos | Waste heat is so often wasted Indeed so. I did float this as an idea some years ago, but there was no interest on the owner's part. Less initial investment (under £400 IIRC) for the large heater & red diesel bought 8000 litres at a time is (currently) quite cheap (around 50p / litre or less, I think). And it is possible we will move premises at some point, so less incentive to plumb up the place. I would like to use some of the unused electrical capacity of the generator to run a couple of 25 Kw electric space heaters, but that would also involve a fairly large capex as there is currently no spare capacity on the distribution boards. I am aware of the potential effieciencies of using all the output from a genset - my brother is involved in such installations for commercial premises, using large V8 diesel engines converted to run on mains gas (different pistons to lower the CR & an ignition system fitted). IIRC he quoted something like 96% of input energy harvested from the generator, coolant & a heat exchanger in the exhaust system. I doubt that I could get that from our 20 year old 7.5 litre Iveco turbo diesels, though ! Nigel B |
David Jupp | 27/01/2017 13:29:53 |
978 forum posts 26 photos | Heating the air in any large space will be expensive - infra red heaters (gas or electric) can be an interesting alternative. IR heats equipment/people, very little direct heating of the air. They were used in a large, draughty warehouse cum loading bay at a factory where I used to work. |
not done it yet | 18/04/2020 19:58:48 |
7517 forum posts 20 photos | Posted by Lisa Martin on 18/04/2020 18:57:33:
Air Choice Electric Space Heater Day rate for leccy is around 17p/kWh Natural gas is around 4p/unit. No contest, even with a heat exchanger that is little better than 50%! Electricity is a high grade energy source. Thermal is a lower grade of energy. Don’t waste resources. Edited By Neil Wyatt on 18/04/2020 20:44:22 |
not done it yet | 18/04/2020 20:47:42 |
7517 forum posts 20 photos | Mods, As you appear to have dispensed with Lisa Martin, you may as well delete these last two posts, by me, on this thread.🙂 |
Ed Duffner | 18/04/2020 21:55:18 |
863 forum posts 104 photos | Log burning stove/fire? ...with a flue. Ed. |
Pete Rimmer | 18/04/2020 22:30:33 |
1486 forum posts 105 photos | Posted by David Jupp on 27/01/2017 13:29:53:
Heating the air in any large space will be expensive - infra red heaters (gas or electric) can be an interesting alternative. IR heats equipment/people, very little direct heating of the air. They were used in a large, draughty warehouse cum loading bay at a factory where I used to work. I know it's an old thread but I agree with this as a consideration.I heat my workshop with a single 2kw infra-red heater and it's 215 sq/ft so three of those or a pair of 3kw should keep the OP's work space comfortable to work in, depending on height and insulation. I have a second one but two running make the place uncomfortably warm, I only use the second if I want to do a bit of painting on a large item. |
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