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Metric vs Imperial - Practical or Traditional?

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Nicholas Farr05/11/2010 21:59:23
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Hi all, 13 pages a bakers dozen, seems this thread is imperial. (pun intended)
 
Regards Nick.
blowlamp05/11/2010 22:02:49
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Posted by Terryd on 05/11/2010 21:45:00:
225 inches = 118" - 9" as I said
 
5715mm does not equal 225 feet as Ian Stated!
 
QED
 
T

 

Edited By blowlamp on 05/11/2010 22:04:41

Edited By blowlamp on 05/11/2010 22:06:23

blowlamp05/11/2010 22:09:20
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I know that, but he obviously made the mistake of putting feet where he meant to put inches.
 A bit like the mistake you've just made
 
Martin.

Edited By blowlamp on 05/11/2010 22:15:21

Terryd05/11/2010 22:15:25
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Which mistake did I make? Please elucidate

I believe that my calculations were correct!
 
5715mm = 18' 9" = 225 inches
 
225feet (Ian's assertion) = 68.58 metres
 
Quelle probleme?   118 was a typo, QED it is very easy to add an extra digit, much more difficult to type feet instead of inches.  As I said - equivalent ot Chris Stevens decimal problem. see my slightly earlier post on the subject.
 
 

Edited By Terryd on 05/11/2010 22:22:47

Edited By Terryd on 05/11/2010 22:25:36

Edited By Terryd on 05/11/2010 22:26:42

Nicholas Farr05/11/2010 22:26:06
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Hi Terryd, look at your follow up posting. (second one)
 
Regards Nick
ady06/11/2010 00:45:34
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...oops...we just crashed into Mars...again.
 
Anyone want to build a satellite in cubits and palms? those guys have a good record of accuracy.

Edited By ady on 06/11/2010 00:47:03

ady06/11/2010 00:55:36
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I think we're missing the essential ingredient for accurate measurements, proper working practices.
The great pyramid is still the most accurate structure ever built because the builders were motivated to get it right.
 
If you got it wrong then your eyes were gouged out and you were disembowelled in front of your work colleagues.
 
NASA should learn from this.
pault06/11/2010 01:15:33
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Sorry I don't see the problem. When I was an apprentice we had a mix of imperial and metric machines and drawings, and that is still true for me today. You just got on with it whatever combination of machines and drawings you had. It’s not hard to convert so work in whatever you are happiest in. At the end of the day there is no right or wrong answer, it is purely a question of personal choice.>>

Nicholas Farr06/11/2010 07:40:33
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Hi,
    Posted by Paul Trotter on 06/11/2010 01:15:33 At the end of the day there is no right or wrong answer, it is purely a question of personal choice.>>
 
Exactly what others and myself have been saying. Whichever unit of measurement you use, you can make identical parts. (unless you pretend one or the other doesn't exists or is US)
 
Regards Nick.
blowlamp06/11/2010 08:38:44
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I had to smile when I read the post above by ady, which says "...If you got it wrong then your eyes were gouged out..."
and is followed by paul trotter's comment of "Sorry I don't see the problem..."
 
 
Martin.
Paul Hanson06/11/2010 09:34:51
3 forum posts
This thread is interesting - the debate seems to go which is better for one person or another and historical facts, knowledge about wierd units etc
 
I think we are missing an important point - what does it look like for a newcomer coming into the hobby? I am a newbie and I have to admit it all looked pretty daunting and off putting (do I buy a metric or imperial machines or drills bits etc).
 
It's all straight forward for the experts - it looks less wonderful for new recruits (who increasingly will be metric oriented only)
Nicholas Farr06/11/2010 10:05:12
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Hi Paul, you buy whichever machine you feel comfortable with. There is nothing wrong with going all metric. All engineering is a compromise against cost, therefore if you have plans with imperial threads for instance, you can sustitute them for metric ones. Its really only basic arithmatic.
 
Regards Nick.
blowlamp06/11/2010 11:45:35
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I haven't read the whole of this thread, but I think we all need to get DRO's or this discussion will never end.
 
Martin.
KWIL06/11/2010 11:53:40
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I have DROs on all machines but it does not stop you choosing whatever suits you.
chris stephens06/11/2010 12:07:15
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Hi Paul,
This was going to be my last post on the subject and it was going to say "I give up".
 
Instead I shall try to offer some advice. If you are starting in this hobby of ours, the first machine you need will be a lathe. If you buy new, get a metric one and ask them to throw in a calculator. If buying pre-owned, get the best you can afford and hang the units its calibrated in. Note here that some lathes have proper dual marked hand wheels, like my Colchester Bantam. I doubt you will be buying a new Myford, so this anomaly wont interfere, but their Metric lathe has an Imp(tpi) gearbox????
 
Now some advice on things like drills, buy metric. A set of 1-5.9 and 6-10 , in 0.1mm increments, will cover most threading and reaming requirements, to which you can add drills going up by 0.5mm as needed. Metric drills are much more sensibly marked than either "number" or "letter" drills. Other cutting tools will be metric these days, so go with the flow.
 
You are entering and interesting and fulfilling pastime, and you should realize that all it takes to convert from one system of measurement to the other is merely the matter of pressing a few buttons on a calculator. There may be some who say you should not have to do this and if everything was to the same measurement standard you would not have to. Well where's the fun/challenge in that?
 
 To summarize, if new buy metric, if used get the best you can afford. 
 
 chriStephens
Ian Abbott06/11/2010 12:22:53
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Sorry, I didn't double check the calculator.
 
The theatre is in fact 225 feet outside measurement, the ridiculous millimetre figure on the plan should have been 68580 mm.
 
Lesson, don't type messages when someone else is trying to clear the table 
 
Ian 
Ian Abbott06/11/2010 12:28:58
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While I was sending the last message, the boss, who is completely Imperial illiterate, said, "Oh, that's easy, all you do is move the decimal point two places, or should that be three places, no one place, yes two, I think."
 
Ian 
Chris Trice06/11/2010 17:17:18
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The only points I've repeatedly made are:
 
That metric as a system is scientifically logical being cross linked with other forms of measure such as weights and densities, where Imperial is a system based on unscientific arbitrary human whim and nothing else.
 
People can use whatever system they prefer... Most can work in both and that's cool.
 
.... but the imperials who refuse to see metric and deny it are eventually going to drown in the incoming tide (or at least get their feet wet...).
 
No one is being told to convert to metric now! They're simply being alerted that the metric tide is inevitably on its way in and the imperial sandbank they're standing on is eventually going to get  swamped and submerged. They can climb aboard the metric raft at any time or simply stand their ground trying to keep their imperial heads above water because they like the feel of imperial sand beneath their feet (feet, get it?). How long the tide will take is up for debate but it will still arrive.
 
Here's an interesting thought. Any imperial measurement of any kind (inches, thou's fractions, feet) can be expressed in the same metric language, millimetres, however try to express 7.5mm (a random example plucked from the air) in imperial measures using anything other than decimal subdivisions of inches. The calculation is mind mangling unless you use a single multiplication factor to "scale up" millimetres to thou's. Anyone want to throw in an exact fraction of an inch without rounding to the nearest 64th" (a large step in precision engineering terms)? If nothing else, it illustrates the complexity of anything other than a decimal system in which case 10" should equal a foot and 10' equal a yard. 
 
 
 
 

Edited By Chris Trice on 06/11/2010 17:19:21 typo's

Edited By Chris Trice on 06/11/2010 17:21:30

Versaboss06/11/2010 18:19:32
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Sorry gents, I cannot help laughing a hole into my belly, as we use to say here.. The least I would expect from you 'imperialists' would be not to make such silly mistakes, which invariably are excused as 'oh, that was just a typo' or as ' sorry, did misread the calculator'.

Jan, 5715 mm is not  the same as 225 ft; ok we had this one.

Terryd, if I see on a plan something written as 118" - 9", how long would I cut a string or whatever? An easy one for a 10 years old; well 118 minus 9 is 109 inches, isn't it?

Crashing into Mars, as Ady rightfully remarked...

Going in Chris' footsteps, my last contribution also. Except maybe when even more silly mistakes have to bemoaned.

Greetings, Hansrudolf




Stub Mandrel06/11/2010 20:15:21
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Chris
 
Can you explain the scientific logic behind the hectare?
 
 
 
Neil
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