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powerfile bands

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Paul White 326/06/2010 10:39:36
109 forum posts
23 photos
Hello all,   I use and have found the  Black & Decker  powerfile to be a most usefull tool. However a major problem exists with the use of this item,( for me anyway) ,  the failure of the abrasive band joints. As yet I have failed to wear one out ,they are failing at the joint in very short time . Has any body a satisfactory repair that can be shared?  Or any other comment.
 
Many thanks.  Paul.
Keith Long26/06/2010 11:54:47
883 forum posts
11 photos

Hi Paul

Are the belts designed to run in one direction only - some sanding belts are and are marked on the back with an arrow. It's so the joint in the belt works in a "trailing direction" rather than a "leading" one. Running the other way round the forces from the work may tend to lift the end of the slice and tear the belt apart.

Just a thought.

For repairs. if the belt has opened along the spice a flexible glue such as Evo-stick might be worth trying.

Try doing an internet search on sanding belts, most pro woodworkers buy them as rolls of abrasive material and cut and join them in the shop themselves to suit the machines in use.

Keith

Paul White 326/06/2010 14:26:10
109 forum posts
23 photos
Keith,  Many thanks for your response.  I should have stated in my original post that the belts are joined by an adhesive strip across the back of the splice. This form of construction does not seem to define a direction of run. The join appears to be held by some form of heat activated adhesive.
 
I will try the suggested internet  search and if I find a solution (ha-ha) i will post it, I can't believe that I am the only person suffering this problem.
 
Again thanks Paul.
chris stephens26/06/2010 14:50:33
1049 forum posts
1 photos
 Hi Paul,
If you follow the advice of Anthony Mount (and me also) buy your belts from J&L.their "Zirconium" range are particularly good. Although the joint is taped , I have not broken one yet.
If you have an adventurous turn of mind you could also cut sections of proper belt sander belts, there is one which has the same length belt but it is about 3" wide, which of course will make several for a powerfile. 
If you have belts that has a glued joint, which has failed, Super glue will join them back together, but do try to keep everything in line!
I have shortened belts before (for a linisher) by removing the abrasive to create a scarfed joint and used Super glue to stick the ends together, so it can be done!
If anyone is interested in why I was being such a cheapskate, I was given some belts and i was not going to let them go to waste.
 It must be remembered that how you use your powerfile, does have an effect on belt life.
 christephens 
Billy Mills26/06/2010 15:35:21
377 forum posts
Hi All,
Yep I'm a beltsander fan as well. The B & D powerfile is very handy for all sorts of  'adjustments' and clean ups. It is very good on wood too for mortices, lock fitting and door hanging when you encounter the difference between approximate dimensions and reality while holding up a kitchen unit.
 
There was a narrower belt  accesory  which was a replacement arm and roller to run about half width belts.
 
Makita make a 1" wide handheld beltsander  9030 which is a seriously useful- more industrial tool- and has a good range of belt grits available.
 
I have never had a belt come apart on the B&D or Makita machine although have worn many out. As well as the direction it would be worth checking that the rubbing block has a slight chamfer- not a sharp edge- where the belt starts to rub  the block.  Have had the block fall off the Powerfile. ( The Makita has a steel ski shaped strip to support the inside of the belt- it seems to last forever)
 
If the belt tension was very high then the belts would not last too long, The only other cause might be if the belts had been stored at a high temp or in sunlight  that could weaken the bond or if the belts were very old. Think that the Powerfile has been around for well over 30 years- could be 40+  
 
One last thought, when the grits get a little smooth it is tempting to apply too much pressure, better to change the belt and save the smoothie for  de-rusting.
 
Regards,
Alan.
 
Paul White 326/06/2010 17:38:43
109 forum posts
23 photos
Chris,Alan,  
                     Thanks for your comments.
 Chris-, I  am also a cheapskate having   performed most of the actions you describe, and under similar  circumstances.
I have not tried superglue,my attempts were with Araldite but all on lap joints.
 
 Alan- I have a Makita belt file and also have had no problem with belt failures, having just checked all the belts are lap jointed. The B&D belts are both lap jointed and taped. All the failed belts are taped joints also the grit is coarse (40).  The lesson I think is that coarse grit should be lap jointed. 
A final thought , I would like to have caused the failure by overloading a worn belt!
 
The remaining question is; any thoughts out there for an adhesive to repair the failed belts or a source of the tape.
 
regards Paul
Billy Mills26/06/2010 18:27:20
377 forum posts
HI again,
A solid setting glue will not stand the flexure. A rubber based glue might be better- evostick original is the easy to get one. Would go for  the original -rubber in solvents- not the latest water based glue. After you have let it dry then clamped the joint let it cure for  days before you do the destruct test.
 
There are some very specialised industrial adhesive suppliers that you might Google up, I used to deal with a Company  in Hemel Hempstead that  had give away reel ends of fancy cloth based tapes. The 3M website might give a clue,  they have some very strong industrial tapes and transfer adhesives.
 
 
regards,
Alan.
Paul White 327/06/2010 11:09:46
109 forum posts
23 photos
Alan , thanks for your further comments.
 
Your suggestion of using EVOSTIK chimes with Keith Longs, this I will try.
I'll post result in a number of days (procure and mature time).
 
Regards Paul.
chris stephens27/06/2010 14:11:44
1049 forum posts
1 photos
Hi Guys,
Not wishing to be a damp squib, but, will not an Evo-stick joint pull apart with the heat ?
chriStephens 
Billy Mills27/06/2010 16:56:08
377 forum posts
Hi All,
All adhesives fail when heated, just a question  of how hot, what adhesive and stress .  I was thinking that Paul would glue a cloth patch over the back so that there would be a good bond area each side of the  join rather than attempting to butt joint the belt.
 
The belt gets a lot of air cooling so I don't think it will be a bonding failure. However this has got to be one of the toughest gluing jobs. Sounds like finding out about the splice it yourself tape is the very best bet. It  might come from an Abrasive Company ( so they might be a bit rough to deal with.)
 
 
Sorry,
Alan.
 
 
 
and lots more
 
 by googling sanding belt jointing.
 
 
 
 
 

Edited By Katy Purvis on 01/06/2015 09:25:33

Edited By Katy Purvis on 01/06/2015 09:45:40

Versaboss27/06/2010 23:13:17
512 forum posts
77 photos

Hi all,

can someone explain why, when clicking one of the links given by Alan Gray, this nice forum software tries to call e.g.  >http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Making_Sanding_Belts.html<

what naturally results in a 'Page not found' ?????

Arrrghhh...

Asked otherwise: how has a URL to be given so that this does not happen???

Frustrated (again), Hansrudolf


Billy Mills27/06/2010 23:43:01
377 forum posts
Sorry Hansrudolf,
Used the chain link  icon then ctrl-v to paste the link but seems to have invisably picked up the http:// as well - probably my fault.
Anyway typing the address takes you there or googling 'sanding belt jointing' will keep you reading for ages. There is a magic tape but it comes from Australia!
 
regards,
Alan.
 
The following is a quick ctrl-c ,ctrl-v   without using the 'link'  but I will have to post it  so here goes.
 
 

Edited By Katy Purvis on 01/06/2015 09:29:29

NJH27/06/2010 23:43:14
avatar
2314 forum posts
139 photos
Hi Hansrudolf
 
Try   typing  ;-
http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Making_Sanding_Belts.html
Directly into your browser bar. 
That should get you there
 
When  I clicked on the posting it inserted  : http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/
in front of the  link. and , of course, it failed.
 

 
Regards
 
Norman
 

Edited By NJH on 27/06/2010 23:50:00

Billy Mills27/06/2010 23:45:13
377 forum posts
Nope it added http:// onto the line, Perhaps it's time to read the instructions!
 
regards,
Alan.
Brian Oldford28/06/2010 08:44:39
avatar
686 forum posts
18 photos
If these belt are glued with a heat activated glue one thought is to make sure the belt isn't slipping and thus creating enough heat to soften the join.
Terryd28/06/2010 09:19:52
avatar
1946 forum posts
179 photos
Hi There,
 
I can't get Alan's links to work but I think that these will:
 
Here, and,
 
 
And By the way Alan, there are no instructions on this site. Some of us have been asking for a 'Help' menu for quite a while, but the web editor seems to have gone very quiet at the moment, especially on that subject.
 
To insert a URL, copy the URL using 'ctrl v', then type a word or phrase like 'here' or 'Sanding belt making' in your post, highlight the word or phrase just typed and click on the chain symbol above.  You can then paste your URL into the space provided.  I always then set it to open the website in a new window using the 'Target' drop down list.  Sounds complicated, takes seconds.
 
By using a keyword to provide the link it avoids the problem of over long URLs which cause havoc on this system at times.
 
regards
 
Terry

Edited By Terryd on 28/06/2010 09:21:35

Versaboss28/06/2010 11:09:46
512 forum posts
77 photos

Hi all,

the links given by Alan gray at 23:43 still show the same effect, 

Yes, NJH, I know that I can re-type the link or edit it in my browser's link field (over 35 years in IT business learned me that), but that's a nuisance, isn't it?

Even more strange is, iirc, that it sometimes is possible to insert a link which is not recognized by the forum software. It will not be converted to bold/blue, ant therefore not directly callable. Why this happens escapes me.

Anyway, it would be nice to know how to insert a ordinary URL without the trick mentioned by Terryd. For long links I usually convert them with TinyUrl. Many forums or mail systems can accept them without playing havoc as here, but then can't link correctly when the URL wraps to the lnext line, Hope you understand my pidgin English!

Greetings, Hansrudolf


Versaboss28/06/2010 11:09:48
512 forum posts
77 photos

Deleted double posting---sorry! My mouse likes to generate double-clicks! I hope not this time...

Greetings, Hansrudolf


Edited By Versaboss on 28/06/2010 11:11:46

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