Is Knurling a health hazard?

I wouldn't worry about knurling, it's the touch screens now being used in public places you need to worry about. It's a well known healthcare fact that one in three people have feces residue on their on their hands!

Did they the suggest that distilling of fermented barley may spoil the health benefits ?

Damn, I better kick the habit then. I always specify the extra coarse knurled grips as they're the juiciest!

Michael W

My point is that 'under exercised immune systems' does not stack up with 'fewer infections'. More infections would excercise the immune system.You need the exposure to train the system. Asthma is an allergic reaction.

You really need to habituate not sensitise. Small amounts of intermittant exposure sensitises and then you get an allergic reaction. Continuous exposure habituates and you don't. It's not as simple as you would think.

The main point is that humans have lived around animals for millenia and our immune systems have adapted to cope with the pathogens and proteins encountered. Urban living has removed most af the exposure and that causes issues.

You are probably right about farm kids having fewer infections that lead to illness but that may be because of the lifestyle, exercise, food , fresh air etc.

regards Martin

they distill poor quality wine to make brandy, so obviously best bitter is of higher quality than scotch! I also find it less likely to render me legless, as old age prevents me drinking it by the gallon (mis-spent youth playing rugby)

Edited By duncan webster on 18/05/2017 11:00:22

Martin, as posted b4 - were you MRC-LMB ?

Although conscious of the serious drift here away from the OP's question; asthma is a generic term of course, what is at issue is 'extrinsic allergic asthma' or hypersensitivity. You wrote " Small amounts of intermittant exposure sensitises and then you get an allergic reaction. Continuous exposure habituates and you don't. It's not as simple as you would think". Your 1st sentence is correct, the 2nd not so for an atopic individual exposed to chemical allergens in the workplace. I spent many years investigating hypersensitivity to diisocyanates and once sensitised, a worker could not tolerate exposure to even "a few molecules" of -NCO.

Relevance to model engineering ? Probably minimal, but we may encounter chemical allergens. Twin-pack isocyanate paints are a recognised inhalation hazard, colophony in soft solder flux, numerous adhesives etc less so. An awful lot of hyperbole is written about health hazards but minimising exposure is always worthwhile.

Hi Fowler, I still am.

I am an engineer not a scientist I would hast'n to add but you do pick up an awfull lot of knowledge if you take an interest. My basic point was that the immune system is far more subtle than you think as you have no doubt had first hand knowledge of in your own work. I was responding to the farm animal exposure point really which from an evolutionary perspectve should be a normal part of our continuous exposure in a way that industrial chemicals are not.(generally).

"minimising exposure is always worthwhile" cannot dissaree on a general basis, with the notable exception of vaccination.

Always welcome more informed opinion to my comments, I learn more that way.

regards Martin

<Pedant Alert>

Humans are animals. That means we have immune systems that pre-date our current ape-like form right back to the origins of life. Possibly the big problem isn't that we are in trouble adapting to them, the problem is that, since the Industrial Revolution, they can't adapt to us.

<\Pedant Alert>

Anyway the point I really wanted to make is that measuring health is more to do with statistics than personal experience. 'My granny lived till she was 98 and she smoked 80 a day and drank like a fish', is not good evidence for that life-style choice. The way immunity develops is often good for populations as a whole rather than for the individuals concerned. The trouble coming to conclusions from 'living on a farm is good for you' is that the population is small compared with the many variables that might be causing the effect. And in the long run Farming is associated with a high suicide rate.

Simple test cases that observe millions of participants are much more reliable. If you create a slab of bacteria-friendly nutrient and taper it with an antibiotic strong at one end, weak at the other, seeding with vulnerable bacteria at the weak end will result in antibiotic proof bacteria eventually appearing at the deadly end. That's very good news for the surviving bacteria, but not for the millions killed during the selection process!

Even with well designed experiments, you still have to take care with the analysis: it's not unknown for scientists trained to avoid 'Confirmation Bias' and the like to blunder badly. As in 'Cold Fusion' for example.

Dave

That's a cross-contamination issue, it's a non-issue for anyone who is the only user of their own equipment and/or anyone who properly cleans and oils their tools on a regular basis.

A much bigger threat to the species is the oft quoted desire amongst machine operators to stick their hands into moving tooling or work and their subsequent obsession with not storing anything anywhere which might tempt a brain-dead individual to reach over or through said tooling or work. :D

".......blunder badly. As in 'Cold Fusion' for example."

Somewhat tongue-in-cheek.........and more germane to model engineering than evolution of immune systems.....

I used to be an occasional viewer of "Instructables". A website which sometimes contained items of workshop interest. Your reference to cold fusion reminded me of an "Instructable" on how to build a fusion reactor !

**LINK**

Perhaps one of our brethren has already built one to the instructions ??????????

If contemplating a build, please note one of the questions and its answer:-

Of course we are. Perhaps I should have said 'Humans have been around other animals for millenia. Particularly domesticated farm animals'.

regards Martin

The mention of Porton Down takes me back to my time at A&AEE Boscombe. One of the (D) Helo Sqdn tasks was the annual deer count for culling estimates. The wild life at Porton was quite amazing - apart from a VERY special orchid (protected by its own fencing), the deer were in marvellous condition and the foxes were the sleekest, healthiest looking examples I've ever seen. Presumably being fenced in and, generally, undisturbed, provided an ideal habitat. Funny combination of function ... nasty nasties and ultra eco-friendliness!!

rgds

Bill

I know this is a red herring but I would have to add that the cold fusion topic is not as dead and buried as you might think, the research simply carries on under a different name.

Michael W

Mike E.:

As a barrier cream for dry (ie not involving water) work I have found nothing to beat PR88; certainly not cheap but very economical used correctly.

Martin, you are completely innocent of all charges. My fault. I knew exactly what you meant and not only that agreed with it. Trouble is I'm in a funny mood today and just couldn't resist being a pedant. Sorry...

You're right, I should be saying 'fewer serious infections'

Neil

The research I looked up was in the USA, which has quite a lot of farms!

There are all sorts of other problems around farming - zoonoses, poisoning, getting eaten by tractors ... the most dangerous occupation in the UK, at least it was about 20 years ago.

Neil

Zoonoses! New word of the day thank you. For a dedicated hypochondriac like me it's an absolute gift. I can't wait to see my GP again.

Dave