Lighting advice

As I get older and eyesight gets poorer, I can't have too much light. 15'x15' garage: 5 fluorescent, 5 led equivalent, 2 600x600 led, and a few task lights. And the whole workshop painted white. I don't have to have them all on at once, but it certainly cheers me up on a dull day. I don't have any natural lighting though. I much prefer the LEDs to the fluorescent and they don't shatter when you tap them with a plank (low ceilings).

Not a lighting expert here again .

So, as I stated, Fluorescent tubes and LED lights produce pretty much the same amount of light per wat.

Custom designed LED lights get away with lower power by being directional. So I stick by my claim of equality, since I don't want a dark ceiling or dark line along the top of the walls.

I have a stock of 22W T8 LED 'replacement' tubes. I put them in last time I decided to renew the fluorescents. Took them all out again because they were so dim and replaced with new fluorescents. I've got enough fluorescent tubes in stock for one more cycle of change, then I'll have to invest serious money (£600 at current prices) to replace the current fittings with low profile LED panels. Hopefully the CRI will have improved slightly over the few years that'll take.

So back to the Chris Murphy:- I retract my recommendation for fluorescent lamps, but go for more wattage than you think you'll need.

Edited By Mark Rand on 29/08/2022 09:52:18

27W, running 24/365, will soon likely cost in excess of £120 pa. - so, yes, every little helps, even if only on relatively fewer hours.

As an aside, on the energy costs: Every hour I run my dehumidifier will quite likely cost me well over 10p/20p from October (depending on low or high setting). Last year the dehumidifier was generally run for two hours each night which cost about 7p. This coming winter the cost will likely have more than tripled. That is why I intend heating with a chinese diesel air heater and using the dehumidifier less.

Also my brother (only this last week) bought a large bottle of propane. It cost him just under 13p/kWh (£75 for a 47kg refill) - from Flogas, I think, NOT Calor!. I am expecting mains gas will shortly be more expensive than that, so anyone with a spare MT gas bottle is recommended to exchange it for a full one - before they put up the price!

Edited By not done it yet on 29/08/2022 10:21:40

I've been running my chinese diesel air heater on kerosene bought at the pump into 25 litres cans, last lot cost me 50p per litre and I buy 99 litres at a time, why 99 litres? 100 liters or above require a form declaring usage to be filled in). I've found that the glow plug and combustion chamber remains clean and I'm probably into the low 400 ltrs now.

It takes the chill off and the shop remains dry as now condensate is produced.

Roger

"So, as I stated, Fluorescent tubes and LED lights produce pretty much the same amount of light per wat."

Not sure where you get that from. Flourescents are around 50 to 100 lumens per watt and LEDs come in at 130 lumens per watt. Thats before you consider the directionality. Flourescent tubes are omnidirectional and LED's in general are 110 degree giving a gain of approximately 3.3. So when you take that into consideration the figure for LEDs rises to 429 lumens per watt so roughly 4 time the light output for the same power consumption.

Also not sure where you get your £600 for the panels from unless you are replacing every fitting? They are available for under £20 each. Here is my kitchen with 3 (in home made housings). Pleanty of light for my kitchen. I would put more in a workshop and be intelligent with the placing.

regards Martin

Edited By Martin Kyte on 29/08/2022 13:33:47

Lumens are a measure of light output not brightness. You might change the brightness in part of the area with directional lights, but you aren't emitting any more light.

New fluorescents produce 100lm/W. Clapped out T12 fluorescents that had been in service for a few decades would produce 50lm/W by the time you replaced them (30 years ago for most folk).

Commercial fluorescent light fittings have reflective interiors, so the unidirectional light from the tube is pointed in the directions that it is needed.

So LED and fluorescent are equivalent. The reason for banning them isn't efficiency, it's because they contain 20-40mg of mercury per tube

The £600 is based on 14 3450lm 300mm x 1200mm flat panels at £38.88 each to replace the existing 14 36W HF ballasted flouorescent fittings in a 300m^2 shed with 3.2m high ceiling.

Edited By Mark Rand on 29/08/2022 15:50:17

As I said "thats before you consider directionality" 130 is larger than 100 so watt for watt you get more light output from you LED's.

regards Martin

130 != 429

30% improvement is a poor payback for £600.

Going away now.

When I built my "new" workshop I used 8 twin "naked tube" 5 ft fluorescent fittings. No diffuser or reflector, painted the ceiling and walls brilliant white so the illumination was clear and shadow free. Fittings spaced so each primarily lit an 8 ft square bay. Obviously there was considerable overlap between the contributions of each tube.

Replaced each twin fitting with one daylight white 600 x 600 panel, presumably 40W, after getting fed up with the relatively short life of modern tubes even though its only a 1/4 mile walk to the local electrical shop who keep name brand tubes in stock. Average seemed to be 5 or 6 years per tube.

Workshop is a lot brighter and much nicer to work in. LED CRI is, as Mark says, pretty pants so the light is harsh but edge definition is good. At 68 my eyes need all the help they can get. There is no doubt that the daylight white LEDs are subjectively far brighter than the cool white and warm white breed.

Clive

One of my 2 T8 led tubes failed a few weeks ago (after about 18 months - so much for the super extended lives of LEDs!). When looking for a replacement, I noticed that the 2 local go-to hardware / electrical chains (SFX & TS) seemed to stock a much smaller range of sizes and powers than they did when I bought mine last.

Are 'tubes' a dying breed in repect of the thousand and one other lighting options on the market?

I am sure there is some consolidation in the market, personally I detest that every fitting I desire is Edison Screw and not Bayonet Cap.

Its worth remembering that for detailed work you need about 4 times the brightness (lumens per area) than you can get away with, and your iris will close so it doesn't feel that much brighter, however your focus will improve and you will get less eye strain. Think of it as modest expense to future-proof your eyes.

I have double LED tubes over all of my benches and machines and still use directional task lighting because it still makes a terrific difference.