A model engineer gone wrong?

Knives do not exist to kill people. Guns solely exist for that purpose.

Actually, they do not.

Amongst other things, I shoot clays, paper targets, pigeons, deer and much more. All of the guns used in those pursuits were designed for exactly that, not to kill people.

Guns don't kill people, people do.

Edited By David Standing 1 on 15/11/2017 15:39:01

Reminds me of Tom Lehrer singing:

"Once the rockets are up, who cares were they get come down ?

That's not my department" says Werner von 'Braun.

**LINK**

Chris....That's not true (that guns exist only to kill people).....there are several olympic sporting events that are effectivley disfranchised in the uk by our supposedly democratic governemnt........Even tho' the humble carving knife and carpenters hammer are far bigger killers of humans that any .22 target pistols

Lord Roberts helped the UK by setting up national target shooting against a national emergency...which turned out to be WWI..... Be thioughtful!...we can't defend ourselves now and a lack of shooting skills is lekly to be a severe problem again before too long!

I'm sympathetic but comparing the carnage that one gunman in the US was able to achieve in Las Vegas with that possible by any of the Islamist terrorists in London, who thankfully weren't able to get hold of a firearm of any kind, I know which democratic government I'd rather continue to live under.

Jon

Edited By Jon Gibbs on 15/11/2017 16:19:39

Not to mention, when the country is bankrupt and we go to war, every able bodied engineer with a lathe will be asked to make arms and ammunition out of national pride.

One of the latest "weapons" is a vehicle being driven into a crowd as we have recently seen in the UK

Are they going to ban the owner ship of these.....

Oh yes but only if it's diesel powered !!!

That would be the VW Claymore.

David, I could not agree more! Registered firearms dealers have been a bit naughty of late. I just don't want any more regulations for genuine shooters.

Andrew.

I take the point about vehicles but they are clearly not as efficient when used as weapons and have other, slightly more utilitarian, applications...

Armed incidents -

Las Vegas - 58 people dead and 546 injured

Paris Bataclan - 130 people dead and 413 injured

Vehicle based -

Westminster Bridge - 4 people dead 50 injured

Barcelona - 13 people dead and 130 injured

On the whole, I accept that firearms do have some practical purpose, but I don't think it's unreasonable to say that in their main use these days is recreational.

I don't buy the claim that markmanship will be useful when we have our next war. IME most marksmen I know will be well beyond recruitment age if a war comes. 

Jon

Edited By Jon Gibbs on 15/11/2017 16:55:06

Yes recreational, I am far too old for active service.

Andrew.

Yes recreational, I am far too old for active service.

Andrew.

Only if you draw attention to it by linking Model Engineering with illegal firearms.

Speaking of shooting yourself in the foot, I'd say Mr Paul Edmunds has shat comprehensively on the gun lobby. In yet another example a member of the gun community has proved that gun owners can't be trusted.

Tony may be embarrassed that he rolled out the 'knives are bad too' defence when he reads Edmunds statement to the police:

"Edmunds said he was "not responsible for the actions of somebody that buys some things", adding his "duty of care" only extended to not selling to people who "didn't look right".

He told officers: "Like me selling a knife and you take that knife and kill somebody and then the system blames me for selling you the knife.

"It's your problem, got nothing to do with me."

I think it's a shame but there you are. Some of us have shit for brains. Guns don't kill people. People with guns kill people.

Dave

In 2001 there was talk of banning flight simulation software. That didn't happen. BA etc. did stop offering sessions in their commercial simulators. Those came back. The politicians wil be busy with b****t for the forseeable future.

A point that seems to have been missed is that although a gun or knives or even vehicles can be used in a way that can kill or maim, however other than genuine car accidents which can and do happen, the acts of violence are generally undertaken by people who are criminally inclined. As far as I am aware, in this country, very few killings have been commited by a person actually classed as the legal owner of the gun possibly the same senario for the car. Knives and Acid are easy to hide away and easy to get hold of but it would be pretty damned impractical to suddenly ban all guns, all knives, all cars and the use of acids and alkalies, instead there should be much tougher sentences and prisons should be there to punish, deter and segregate the offenders. Then the criminals might thinks twice before embarking in criminal activity, if they do go on to commit an offence lock em up, who's going to miss em.

Sugar and junk food kill more people every year than guns, knives and cars combined, by a factor of at least 10,000. Just does not make good headlines. We worry about all the wrong things.

Edited By Hopper on 16/11/2017 00:57:26

We seem to be forgetting that there is one common denominator here - human beings.

If we ban them (us?) we can eliminate murder altogether, assuming by 'ban' that we don't mean 'murder'.

Then knives, guns, hammers, cars etc become totally benign.

However if you are looking for a real biggy have a look at the current news reports on Yemen - mass murder all done deliberately by disease and malnutrition.

Have a nice day.

Pero

This discussion causes me to recall a good friend from Paris who worked with me in the Canadian mining industry many years ago His father was a major in the French Marines stationed in Vietnam in the early 50s. The Vietnamese revolutionaries were taking a piece of iron pipe; a spring and a nail; and strapping it to a piece of wood to make a very rudimentary shotgun. They were making their own black powder and refilling shotgun cases with whatever was at hand; pieces of lead solder; bits of steel; ball bearings etc. They used wooden match heads and toy caps for ignition. The intent was to fire it only once. Once was enough to get them a French weapon. One amazing bit of information that I have never read about was the care the revolutionaries took not to harm French military families. On nights when they were about to launch an activity, a Viet officer would come to the door and tell Joe's mom to lock the doors; turn off the lights and stay inside until daybreak. He assured his mother that no harm would come to any of the French households. Joe's mom and dad (who of course was on duty elsewhere) were both astounded at this act of chivalry. I was a bit doubtful of this story until I became friends with another mining engineer from Nice who was also a French military child in Hanoi during the same time frame. The same courtesy was paid to his mother. As the affair heated up, the families were sent home.

Laws will rarely overpower the will of a determined people. It has been proven too many times in history.

My digression.

Actually, guns WERE designed to kill whether it be animals or people. They were always a weapon the same as bows and arrows or crossbows. They weren't designed to shoot clay pigeons. The safer forms came later specifically because of the risk of hurting someone with a lethal weapon. No one designs an ineffective tool.