Is CNC cheating

It's not "sad" that few have voted,....I did not vote myself because none of the options reflect the views and perceptions that matter......as I see them.

I make clocks and would certainly use CNC for components were I to have access to it, then I could get on with the parts that would look horrible were they to be made by automation. Then again, I could'nt care less what people think about my methods or whether or not I use 'short cuts'

At the Alexandra Palace show in January my club (EFHC) had a stand where we displayed some completely hand made clocks,...my own clock was made with only one small part having been milled.....Everything else apart from arbors had been carved out with piercing saw and files. The attitudes of visitors were very interesting and often disturbing. We were frequently asked what software we used and one unpleasant character accused me of blatant lying when I told him that everything he was looking at was handwork! Most visitors seemed to think we were mad to do what we do without CNC and I got the distinct impression that membership would be enhanced if people could dabble with CNC in our workshop.....

However, visitors to model engineering shows are not the norm.  The norm are "punters" or 'Joe Public' and they don't really 'get' that there are people who make things by hand.....everything pops out of a machine and there is no actual skill in the making.......unless they see yo udo it.

Edited By Bob Stevenson on 03/09/2016 23:08:46

I remember my old late friend Albert North giving me a billet of brass to turn up a GWR safety valve casing. At the club meeting a month later I showed the finished product, and described how it was turned then the flare filled to shape. 'Bollocks' said Arthur from the wings! He could not see how anyone could file the correct shape. He would have spent months making special jigs to fly cut the complicated radii!

Cheers,

Julian

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In deference to Bob Stevenson, permit me to revise my opening words:

The saddest thing about this thread ...

What saddens me most about this thread ...

MichaelG.

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Hopefully that will now read as a simple non-confrontational statement of personal opinion.

So, how would a skilled machinist fair?

Does it make you a cheat if you are a skilled engineer for a day job, then relax in your shed using similar machines?

Just awonderin

Hi, or a skilled welder, fabricator, fitter or other trades like carpentry and painting and electrical/electronics?

Regards Nick.

Edited By Nicholas Farr on 04/09/2016 07:56:34

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Good Morning, Bob

Sorry if I am labouring this [especially as I have no right to expect you to vote] but; the two sentences I have quoted suggest that a vote of either 'IF NOT DECLARED' or 'NO' would adequately reflect your opinion.

It just seemed a wasted opportunity, when Neil had gone to the trouble of preparing the 'Poll' and the 'turnout' was so poor.

MichaelG.

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P.S. Perhaps your anecdote from the show tells us that CNC in the home workshop is becoming 'presumed' and is therefore 'not cheating' ... but, that the special attribute of 'Made by Hand' should be declared.

Hi Michael,.....It's probably my 'grumpy old git' side causing me to refuse the vote! it just seems inappropriate to vote on such an idea. Perhaps the difficulty is the use of "cheating" in the title. Cheating implies that someone is done out of something and I can't see who and what to my satisfaction!

.....The only person who gets "cheated" by use of automation in model engineering is (possibly) the maker who works only to impress others by his cleverness and 'skill'......but ALL of the many people I know who strive to make things are way past such egotism!

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Fair comment, Bob

MichaelG.

Hi MichaelG, I'm siding with Bob a little bit. Generality speaking, I don't thank it matters, each to there own as they say, but if you intend to put anything on any type of public display, then I believe that any type of operation that is not within the scope of the majority should be declared. I think in competition entries, some form of notes should be compulsory to accompany the display with at least a brief description of machines and procedures used.

Regards Nick.

I am surprised that no one was even complementary or in awe of how much work goes into it. I would be, atleast because i know that historically everything had to be hand made at some point. If you can make a clock by hand i take my hat off to you!

Michael W

............... We had some nice compliments but it's the general trends and overall impressions that I was trying to get across. It's always very interestign talking to the visitors to the show and we have lots of chat afterwards about things that were said and their attitudes to what we do and display.........

..........The toughest thing about making a clock is that it takes a long time and your skill set increases rapidly.....then when you are actually assembling all the bits you are amazed and disgusted by how badly made the earlier parts are! When you get a compliment you KNOW the complimenter is nor really LOOKING!

Maybe people aren't voting, simply because they are not that bothered about it?

Regards,

IanT

What thousands of other readers? The same 103 readers coming back multiple times more like it. Plus doubtless a number of others who take a look at the thread and regard it as too much tosspottery to be bothered with. It is quite possible there are many who simply don't give a toss.

Too late for that... I'm already contemplating the implications of arthritic model engineers taking performance enhancing 'pain relief' drugs to boost their chances of a gold medal.

Martin.

There are two reasons I did not vote:

1. I could see no point.

2. the option I though best was not offered - 'It all depends'.

I suspect that I am not alone.

Cheers, Tim

Don't open any more cans of worms! - next thing we'll have is angst about whether you should have declared if it was an Ikea armchair or a hand-bodged chair made from greenwood on a manual pole-lathe!

Dave (IOM) - one of the 'silent majority' who hasn't voted, who has never built a model but uses the most appropriate manual or CNC machine when needed.

Edited By Dave Martin on 04/09/2016 10:15:12

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MTM's advertising department, and its clients, will be rather disappointed if that's true.

Perhaps Neil has some 'analytics' available ?

MichaelG.

Just buy one and say you made it yourself.

Martin.