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Coolant

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Jim barbour15/08/2009 15:36:28
1 forum posts
I am having problems finding a suitable coolant for my miiling machine and lathe. Soluble fluid goes off very quickly abd it a meesy and smelly job to constantly change it. I thought I had the answer by using tapping fluid diluted with white spirit but this leaves a dark brown residue on the machines which is difficult to remove. Is there any alternative that anyone could recommend ?
 
Thanks, Jim
mgj15/08/2009 16:36:18
1017 forum posts
14 photos
I use Morrisons Unison Edgeplus, which isn't smelly at all. It stays as an emulsion pretty well.
 
For what its worth, I was told always to add the water to the oil - or the other way round. Apparently its important!
 
The trick to stopping the solubles from going off is to circulate them.
 
The big lathe has an agitator paddle on the coolant pump spindle - that stuff never goes off. 
 
The tanks which do the big mill and the  other two bits of kit don't have agitators, and the oil used to be inclined to separate after  a bit. I solved that problem by circulating the coolant. When I go into the workshop, I turn on the pumps for half an hour or so, even if I'm not using the machine. Problem gone -  it doesn't go off.
 
The problem to fix is actually an oil skimmer to collect up lubricating oil - I daresay I'll get round to building a little weir trap one day! And I'll attach a little agitator blade to the 2 untreated spindles.
 
I have to say that I have never used the neat stuff - the soluble works well for me. Doesn't rust or stain the machine, and is cheap (Very -  diluted at 20-1!) I can't be doing with a dab here or there with a brush - done that, trying to turn and cool with three hands. Parting benefits from a decent jet. Milling even on the lathe one needs a bit of a jet to clear the chips so a pump or gravity feed is helpful. As soon as one does that one runs the risk of squirting it onto chuck or milling cutter, and the stuff is all over you or the floor. Its a lot cheaper to lose soluble! I can see that neat is possibly better, if ones cutting is all under covers or in  cabinets, or otherwise well contained - but I'm not as neat with it as that.
wheeltapper15/08/2009 17:42:29
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424 forum posts
98 photos
Hi
I did read somewhere that if you get a fish tank air pump and put an airstone in the coolant tank it keeps it fresh.
just a thought.
 
cheers
the bubbly side of Roy.
Les B04/08/2011 12:26:39
2 forum posts
Just a quick thought on coolant pumps.
I use a parts washer from, Machine Mart , I have used it for several years and have had no problems. A lot cheaper than a dedicated coolany pump. I don't know if anyone else shares my experience.
mick04/08/2011 18:42:52
421 forum posts
49 photos
Back when god was a boy, soluable would go off over night, now it has addatives that prevent it doing so. Soluable shouldn't go off these days, only if you don't use it for months on end, then maybe. Always a good idea to mix water to oil rather than oil to water. Perhaps your mixing it in the wrong ratio, shouldn't be below 40:1 for general workshop use too strong a mix may become solid and lumpy. the only real alternative is mineral oil and that is messey
Jim Nolan05/08/2011 08:08:18
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77 forum posts

I have similar concerns about this as I have a CNC mill which won’t get regular use. Any thoughts on the non water based coolants?

Jim

 
mick05/08/2011 08:58:10
421 forum posts
49 photos
Hi. Jim.
Just write a short programme that will turn the spindle and coolant on and run it a couple of times a week for about 5 minutes or so, its only when the coolant is allowed to stagnate that it goes off
Jim Nolan05/08/2011 20:34:50
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77 forum posts
great idea mick and just about = my gcode skills
 
Thanks
 
jim
Jon07/08/2011 00:07:36
1001 forum posts
49 photos
I also use The Morris soluable cutting oil.
I am about to scrap one machine with it in after 11 years and it dont stink even after being left for months!
 

Bogstandard07/08/2011 15:42:52
263 forum posts
Modern cutting oils have some great properties now compared to the older versions.
 
A friend of mine got me 2 litres of oil used for grinding Aerospace components about 3 years ago. Mixed to a ratio of 100/1 with water, it was put into the sump of my mini bridgeport. It still smells perfectly fresh and stays ready emulsified all the time, and does a great job when used for flood cooling.
 
Has anyone tried spraying?
 
The air acts as the cooling agent and only tales a minute amount of liquid for lubrication. I built a trial unit a while back and it works perfectly on my lathe, using only a spoonful of liquid for a long run, and that usually is evaporated off, so no getting covered with the stuff or big clean ups.
 
 
All I do is fire it onto my thumbnail and as soon as it is adjusted to just so I can see it, that is how it is used. The spray doesn't get airborne and only minute quantities of air and liquid are used.
 
 
John
Jon07/08/2011 22:00:57
1001 forum posts
49 photos
Been thinking about trying spraying for some time and just had another purge on it the last few days.
 
I'll have a look later at your proto John, i like the idea that it looks flexible up to where the air/liquid is delivered rather than the usual fixed straight lengths.
Work well on deep slotting where you would normally get the airline on it?
 
Thinking about a pressurised system for the mill, should be able to get hold of scrap/failed pressure containers/bottles from a diving place. Normally drilled or cut through on fail.
 
blowlamp07/08/2011 22:21:49
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1885 forum posts
111 photos
I find that Sainsbury's Natural Furniture Polish with Beeswax works very well when milling aluminium and keeps my workshop smelling fresh.
One can lasts a long time if you 'give it' the odd squirt while you're working. It's good 'cos it sticks to vertical surfaces without draining off so a little goes a long way.
 
Martin.
Jim Nolan08/08/2011 09:01:28
avatar
77 forum posts

I had also considered spray coolant systems for the mill as they use far less coolant than the current flood system I have, on my mills dedicated forum they seem to recommend fogbuster


http://www.fogbuster.com/


or the Trico system.


http://www.tricocorp.com/products/product.aspx?c=5&p=31


Both come highly recommended as they don’t fill the workshop with coolant mist.


Congratulations though John your system seems to tick all the boxes and is a well engineered solution to the problem.


There has been a guy trying to sell some Bijur systems also on eBay recently without success. They look a far more industrial size unit compared to the ones listed above.

 

Jim
Hugh Gilhespie08/08/2011 09:29:29
130 forum posts
45 photos
Hi, I have just ordered one of these. I will report back when I have it set up. I am going to put it on the mill as I use mainly HSS cutters. I tend to use carbide inserts on the lathe so not quite so much a need.
Bogstandard08/08/2011 17:58:43
263 forum posts
Actually, after the first trial, I was going to make three more, but as usual other things got in the way, and because it required no more development as it mixed perfectly at the nozzle, I never got around to making the others, but I do have everything ready to go sitting in a box.
 
I think why this proto system worked so well was because the air and oil were kept separate until the very last second, and not have an internal mixing chamber. So like being shown in one of the commercial units, the Fogbuster, the lube comes out as droplets rather than a mist.
I honestly think the secret was in keeping the fluid nozzle fairly large, and when correctly set, it was protruding just slightly from the tapered outer air nozzle.
 
I regularly used to part off 3" material (even stainless) and just pointing the nozzle down the slot kept the piece being parted off cool enough to hold in your hand just after it fell off, so the air was keeping it well cool, and with not one drop of coolant being thrown at me.
 
BTW, just as a word of caution, set the air too high and the shop will start to mist up in minutes, giving you an almost instant cough. I run mine just enough to lift the liquid from the open to air tank, with the oil/water mix level just a little lower than the nozzle. 5 to 10 psi should be more than ample to lift the liquid from tank to nozzle.
 
Like most things, I am sure it could be made a lot easier to make, but I was well satisfied with what I ended up with, and costing a lot less than a tenner for everything required to make it, I can't complain.
 
BTW, my Locline came from my usual supplier of cheapo stuff, Richon Tools.
 
 
 
John
 
 

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