Washout plug size

Does anyone know the diameter of B1 washout plugs? From pictures there is the outer raised flange and the inner removable plug. They look quite big, perhaps 5 or 6" over the outer flanged ring. This is not the sort of thing Martin Evans troubled himself with.

Silly of me to ask a model related question on here, I know. I should have asked about songs.

Hmm that's a bit harsh? I have no idea on the answer to your question, as I suspect from the lack of response do most others. I have never been on or up close and personal with a B1. From Loco's I have been on or involved with I believe there are standard sizes for wash out plugs and they are usually tapered threads, So I suspect the outer raised flange could be the bush that it screws into but from the ones I have seen up close and personal 5 or 6" sounds a bit large. The hole in the lagging with its flanged edge may well be that size though. Maybe you can do a search for an old relevant standard which might give you a clue. Outside of that I can't help I am afraid.

Paul.

There is a table of washout plug sizes here **LINK** but if you want the dimensions of the complete fitting, perhaps you can use the cab dimensions to scale from my snapshot of Mayflower.

Brian

Thanks Paul and Brian. The plugs in the link have the large square ends. The B1 looks to have pin spanner holes and a small nut in the middle (locknut?). I might mock something up and see what size looks about right compared with photos. There is a close up in the Vine book on painting but no reference to judge size.

Simon,

From the picture posted by Brian G I assume you are referring to the fittings along the side of the boiler at the level of the firebox crown? Normal convention of description is hand holes I believe for these. Mud hole tends to be the description of the oval doors below the normal water line, hand holes for the similar feature above the normal water line and wash out plugs are as I stated previously normally a square headed tapered threaded plug, typically less than 2" diameter.

I believe the hand holes to which you refer are oval doors in the boiler but rather than the conventional straight door bridge they have a circular 'cover' that bears on the boiler and the small nut in the centre is on the stud fixed to the door. As the nut is tightend the door is drawn onto its sealing face, just like a conventional mud hole door with a bridge but in this case the bridge is replaced by the circular cover. I would think but can't be certain having never fitted a door of this type that the two 'pin' holes in the cover are to allow any leakage to show outside the cover.

Of course none of the above answers your question as to how big they are! Maybe email or call the NRM in the UK and ask if they have a boiler drawing in their archives that gives the detail?

Paul.

Simon

I was going to suggest seeing Mayflower on one of her outings (provided they aren't cancelled due to the weather) but having checked your profile, it would be rather a long journey

I wonder if it might be worth contacting the North Yorkshire Moors Railway instead?

There is a washout plug visible just above the running plate in my photo. Given the driver diameter of 6' 2" it looks to me to be about 4" across the outside of the surround, whilst the surrounds for the mudholes above the firebox would be about 6".

Brian

Be fair between 4:00 and 10:00am is hardly the peak time on the forum...

Neil

True Neil but there has to be activity to wash a post off the board. Perhaps choo-choo people, as Jason would say, are in the workshop by 4. It has taken me a long time to realise this is really a tooling and workshop forum.

You are right Brian, I won't be seeing Mayflower unless someone gives me a TARDIS. I don't know much about full size locos but many have square ended plugs in that position. Thanks for info on the plugs, Paul. They are a prominent feature whatever they are. Brian's picture prompts me to ask about the colour. Is it considered by enthusiasts to be correct for Doncaster green? It looks a touch darker than I expected.

.

Aahh ... That takes me back: **LINK**

https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=113186

Presumably you never resolved the matter to your satisfaction, Simon.

MichaelG.

That depends entirely on the color balance adjustment on the digital camera when the image was taken and on the color balance adjustment on your computer screen when you view it, and the color balance of the room lighting your computer is being viewed in. In other words, you can't tell diddly from an on-screen image. (Or a printed magazine image for that matter.)

Well aware of that, thanks Hopper. I am going on a mental averaging of all the photos and videos I have seen, plus something I heard. Not that I have a clue what the original colour was, and was probably batch dependent anyway. Colours are hard to remember too so an old timer remembering a colour from the 1940s might not be too reliable. It is a fraught subject, especially as it pertains to German WW2 aircraft!

Simon,

It may be worth looking at your messages 'Inbox'?

Regards,

Phil

Don't rely on the colour in my photo Simon, it was taken from the north side on a sunny day, so the lighting is all off. Lucky to get that close at Faversham whilst the loco was being serviced on a railtour. Network Rail now close the footbridge for "Maintenance" when a special is due due to the number of trainspotters that gather on it, but the security guard said he was only stopping people using the footbridge, nobody told him to guard the access road

Brian

Simon,

These nice people offer to send you an actual sample of their version of the colour: **LINK**

http://www.craftmasterpaints.co.uk/colours/railway-archive/

MichaelG.

I had a Phoenix paint chip in a booklet on B1 colours and lining, got paint made and it looked more like BR green, so I dicided not to use it. I'll check the other brand and the other forum, thanks. You are thorough Michael, I knew I had raised it before somewhere. The thing is, now is the time to actually paint. As I probably said before, it is more a matter of interest what is correct, rather than having mine right, which I don't care about as much as having something I like.

Simon

If you feel you are not getting the correct feedback here, why not ask the same question on 'Model Engineering Clearing House' which is predominately biased?

http://modeleng.proboards.com/

Regards

Dave