flip up screwcutting toolholder in the latest MEW
Bogstandard | 26/06/2011 10:33:21 |
263 forum posts | Don't wait on me Chris, your ideas might be better than mine, plus it could be ages before I can get to it. There are always more ways to skin a cat, usually one easy way, then lots of difficult ones. The secret is finding the easy one, so that everyone can have a go at it. All the people who come up with good ideas and make them available to the public should be commended, Unfortunately, a lot of them are so complicated that it puts them beyond the reach of the average metal murderer, and so maybe only a couple of dozen machines or whatever is shown actually get made. By average, that means we don't have a 5 axis CNC work station, or a spark eroding machine at the bottom of the garden, and never will. |
chris stephens | 06/07/2011 19:32:44 |
1049 forum posts 1 photos | This message is primarily for Bogstandard, but the rest of you might be pleased to hear that I have successfully made an internal version of the flip up threading tool. No pictures just yet and probably not till after the next "work on the table" at SMEE in September.
At present it only works down to about 12mm, but I think that is good enough for most purposes.
At present it appears a little bit rough as it is only a "proof of concept" prototype, but half an hour with a fine file will soon change that, then it will be up to the standard of appearance expected, from me, by SMEE.
chriStephens
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Bogstandard | 06/07/2011 20:09:58 |
263 forum posts | Well done Chris. Working down to 12mm, to me, sounds just fine. Normally, below that sort of size, people will use taps anyway, unless of course you don't have one to hand. I await to see your design, and see how close it comes to what I have thought up. If it is better than mine, maybe I can pinch the idea and give it a good dose of looking at and maybe come up with something that will go down to say 6mm (using 1/4" tooling), which is what I was basing mine on. But I do have grinding facilities that allows me to make tiny cutting tools. If you need any making to maybe get yours to cut smaller, don't be afraid to ask. But I suppose that facility would be available to you thru SMEE. Isn't it a great feeling when things turn out right and work as expected. Again, very well done. John |
wheeltapper | 06/07/2011 20:10:05 |
![]() 424 forum posts 98 photos | Cant wait to see that one Chris, I'm more than happy with my external one. Roy |
chris stephens | 06/07/2011 23:33:43 |
1049 forum posts 1 photos | Hi Bogs,
Thanks or your kind words and offer but I could grind up my own if needed. I did not grind the tool, as I had a few commercial ones to hand. The ones I used are similar to the ones at the top of the page; ;http://www.ifanger.com/fileadmin/Webmaster/Produkte/B_01/020104_Gewindestahl.pdf
I would be glad to hear your opinion of my effort, and of course there would be room for improvement, two heads are often better than one. Everybody's experience is different, so everybody has a different way of doing things, even if the basic principle is the same.
In the next few days I will send a PM with details of the way it works, once I have checked to see if there are any problems that need sorting. Saves "egg-on-face" syndrome.
chriStephens
PS although SMEE has a very well equipped workshop, I have not yet found a need to use it yet, as I have most of what I need to hand in my own Engineerium.
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ady | 07/07/2011 01:27:07 |
612 forum posts 50 photos | It's one of those things that makes you wonder why no one else has thought of this in the last 100 or so years ? --------------------------------------- That's actually a great question. My own answer is this: Reversible motors? who made them? Even a dog clutch was virtually non-existent, when did the ML7 have one?, Drummond M series lathes were made by Myford and were for Destroyers in WW2 and were expensive but when your country is at the edge of armageddon who cares about the expense. So reversible motors were almost non-existent and even dog clutches were a luxury. Sparey never said a thing about dog clutches in his amateurs lathe, not a button. |
ady | 07/07/2011 01:40:42 |
612 forum posts 50 photos | Even nowadays these products struggle. Here's one on fleabay which has been RELISTED I couldn't believe it when no-one bought it the first time round. (A nice schaublin went for less than 50 quid a couple of days ago too.) It's got a multi direction dog clutch, an offset tailstock and was aimed at people who were capable of prototype work. "perhaps the aim was to create a new, high-quality brand aimed at the experimental and top-end amateur sections of the market. In this sense the lathe did succeed ..." Apparently even nowadays folks just aint interested. Edited By ady on 07/07/2011 01:43:53 |
Bogstandard | 07/07/2011 09:45:11 |
263 forum posts | Chris, I am a great believer in taking advice, even if it comes from a raw beginner, almost everyone has a chance to chip into my designs if they feel the need to. Whether I act on that advice is another thing, but it does give the sharer a feeling of actually contributing and maybe helping in the final design. Plus they always get the due recognition if their idea is used, or why it wasn't used is most probably shown in the post as well. No one knows everything, although some people think they do, but until they prove to me they too can walk on water, they don't. So why not take advantage of the people about you, they do have a lot to contribute. Like yourself, which I have read in other posts by you, I don't charge anything for advice, or in fact anything that I do, the only proviso being that if they too can help someone, they do it freely and without charge. To me that is what forums and discussion groups are all about. It always leaves a bad taste in my mouth when someone does a post about making say a small and simple engine, showing no dimensional details at all, only to find at the very end, 'you can buy the plans from..................' I always have a feeling to do the same post, but showing all the dimensions and plans as I go along. To me, sharing and helping for free is what it is all about. BTW, just after the swing up toolpost became public and was proved to work, a German chappie started to advertise them for sale, but to a different design. I have done a very rough sketch of his method of doing it, if anyone wants to give it a go. In fact my design for the internal one is very loosely based on it. John |
Ken Strauss | 15/07/2011 03:11:22 |
8 forum posts | I'm curious about the German design that you mentioned. Any links to an advert or other details? |
chris stephens | 15/07/2011 10:36:30 |
1049 forum posts 1 photos | Hi Ken,
There are three videos on You tube
is part one, the other parts should be obvious when you have finished watching it.
All the different ways of making these tools just reflect the makers individuality, the principle is the same in each case. The most important thing to design in, is free movement whilst still keeping rigidity. The Cox , Bogs and JohnS design has a block that locates the flip up part, but the German one uses bearings, you pays your money and takes your choice.
chriStephens
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Phil Franklin | 19/11/2016 18:06:13 |
1 forum posts | Hi all, i know I'm terribly late joining in with this v interesting thread (!) .... but thought I might just have some things to add that might turn a bulb on somewhere....I was dreaming about a flip-down tool originally held up by (probably) an electromagnet that was released by a micro-switch - hence no problems with flicking the drive out at the right instant, time and again. I have to admit that the flip-up seems a better solution but would be so nice if accompanied by a pair of micro-switches that one sets up at the ends of the thread and the lathe then just trundles up and down between the 2 while you put on the cut (top or cross slide) until done! What could be simpler/ more satisfying? Has anyone done this? Another little thought; coming from an engine background, where if at all possible sliding bearings are avoided since their specific loading is generally low compared to rotating bearings, I would suggest that the most efficient structural design for the swinging element would be a triangle where the pivot was along one "leg" and the tool at one corner, the pivot bearings being at the other 2 corners. May not fit toolposts that well of course!, but may just spark something off in someone's head to make what appears to be an exceptional idea, even better. Many thanks to all who have contributed to the development of this idea - if there wasn't CNC then this would have had a big impact on the manufacturing world I'm sure, although coventry dieboxes are brilliant bits of kit too, and thread rolling for high volume / thread strength can't be bettered. cheers all, Phil |
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