MEW Workshop Tales Artie Moore and Titanic

Well, not bad for the time. It's not that different from recreations of the Titanic's Radio Room, apparently based on that fitted to RMS Olympic, a sister ship.

The transmitter's induction coil is about the same size, but I think this is a small backup transmitter. The big iron was in an adjacent Silent Room, heavily soundproofed because of the noise made by a power spark. Rather than a pair of brass balls, these had spinning rotary gaps with compressed air to keep them cool and quench the arc. Artie might have had a 100W, compared to a kilowatt or more on a ship.

The Titanic's receiver is considerably better than Artie's: the Titanic had a reliable magnetic detector and tuning.

What makes the biggest difference is the aerial and 'conditions'. Small low aerials are very inefficient, and a poor earth soaks up power. And an efficient radio earth is far more elaborate than that needed for mains electricity safety or lightning protection. The geology makes a big difference and the earth itself is a large copper mesh, hundreds of metres across.

As Artie's receiver had no amplification, his headphones were driven entirely by the energy picked up by the aerial. A small efficient aerial would only work with strong signals, which isn't impossible. Early radio men noticed many anomalies. Although reliable spark range varied from 75 to 300 miles during daytime and 600 miles at night, it wasn't unusual for much longer distances to be covered. Turned out that radio waves sometimes bounce repeatedly between ionised layers up to about 300km high and the ground. Instead of disappearing into outer-space at the horizon, they're bounced back to earth again from a great height, coming back down thousands of miles away at considerable strength, perhaps skipping several times. Skipping is most common at high frequencies, but Artie may have been lucky, or his antenna picked up a short wave harmonic.

Or, maybe he heard one of the many repeats. No doubt every Marconi fitted ship in the Atlantic passed the news to other ships in range, so just maybe the ship Artie heard was repeating it from the Bristol channel. (Unlikely!)

They were exciting times. A new technology, almost magic, that turned out to be full of surprises, and still is!

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 19/06/2023 22:28:43

There's a good chance he was twiddling at 4am when it all kicked off

You only have to look at his 1912 rig to see how seriously he took it

Hi Dave,

That is very interesting!

Olympic and Titanic had the most powerful transmitting sets. Titanic had new type of transmitter with a different sound. The Californian had quite a good set apparently of 1.5kw but running on lower voltage (60v instead of 100v) and was nevertheless very good. Carpathia’s set was quite knackered. It needed repair apparently when it later returned to dock at New York with those whom it had rescued from Titanic. The Mount Temple early on found the Carpathia’s signals faint. The Baltic also seemed to have had a bit of a duff set.

Cape Race picked up the CQD from Titanic and contacted the Virginian. Manned by 2 wireless operators same as Olympic and Titanic, and with quite a good set. On Titanic, Phillips initially had difficulty hearing on his earphones due to steam venting off from the forward boilers.

Most ships had the earlier 1.5kw set, and in some cases such as the Carpathia’s, not working very well.

I think it very unlikely that Artie Moore would have been able to receive any messages from any of the ships with the earlier 1.5kw set. A big White Star liner such as the Baltic with Marconi Inspector Balfour on board had trouble transmitting to Titanic after receiving the CQD. The Mount Temple and the Carpathia kept silent after their initial exchanges with Titanic saying in effect they had turned round and were on their way to the CQD position.

Had Evans on The Californian stayed up after his DDD from Phillips around 11.05pm ships time on The Californian warning of being stopped due to ice some 45 minutes earlier, it’s quite effective set (only a year old) might have made a difference.

So I think that pretty much rules out any ships other than Olympic and Titanic. Titanic with it’s new thingy sending the spark.

I have not found any evidence of other ships other than those relatively close to Titanic except Olympic further away picking up it’s signals. There is no evidence of say a ship off Ireland or going up the Bristol Channel to Swansea or Cardiff or Bristol receiving any signals at all in respect of the Titanic disaster that Artie Moore could perhaps have easily been able to receive. That also assumes that he spent every night (when at night time messages transmitted could be received at much longer distances) up listening on the off chance for something of interest. Then going asleep during the day when his Dad probably would like him to help out in the business of the trade and running of the Mill.

Edited By julian atkins on 20/06/2023 01:09:41

Oooops. I got that back to front didn't I. Sorry bout that. London is of course 5 hours ahead of NY, not behind. Even so, it is quite possible Artie was out twiddling at 4 or 5am. People rose early in those days. And it would have been far too late for the morning newspapers to have the story so he was still ahead of the general public in hearing about it.

It certainly is a fascinating story, or should we say stories? A further article would be well read I am sure.

He only had to be awake at that moment in time, these things DO happen

I walked in when the second plane struck the WTC, and thought it was a disaster movie for the first few seconds

I was watching the lunchtime news when that guy immolated himself in front of Thatchers 10 Downing Street, an immolation that never happened by the time the six o'clock news came out (They D-noticed it.)

Weird stuff happens, it's a funny old world

Radio guys can "sleep" at their post, plenty did the job like that if they were waiting for incoming traffic

We'll never know for sure of course, it was probably a repeated transmission he heard but...

Edited By Ady1 on 20/06/2023 00:55:56

I did look at over 12 months of the Marconigram magazine for 1911/12 and there was criticism of Cunard not updating the set on Carpathia. Obviously no criticism of that which Marconi had supplied and fitted to the Carpathia!

The Marconigram Magazine is now online. Easy to check. No mention of Artie Moore at all in the monthly editions I looked at. Very detailed account of pretty much everything Marconi did and where he went. And who he met. He was incredibly busy in 1912 attending 2 Titanic Inquiries, dealing with an international conference, opening the new site at Chelmsford making his kit (big new factory), a new training school at Chelmsford, then a serious injury in a road accident. Plus the various scandals that emerged over insider share dealings. Quoting Parliamentary Debates.

I really don’t think that taking a detour to visit Artie at Gelligroes would have even been on his radar let alone his agenda or diary.

Edited By julian atkins on 20/06/2023 01:35:39

Julian have you tried tracking down Kevin Dawson to find out his sources? A direct message on Facebook might reach him even if he is no longer active on the society Facebook page? Or he could even be in the white pages.

And what about Lynn Pask of the Blackwood historical society quoted in the very recent BBC report on Artie HERE ? That society must be contactable and is presumably in your neck of the woods somewhere? They may have some original source material?

And Neil Prior, the BBC journo, should be able to put you in touch with the quoted "amateur radio enthusiast Billy Crofts" re the antenna. The BBC Wales switchboard should be able to put you onto Mr Prior. Although not much more to be said on that topic not already shown in the pics and discussion thereof perhaps?

Yes it does seem unlikely. Marconi was a bit of a rock star tech entrepreneur of his day. It would have been like Bill Gates or Steve Jobs visiting Gelligroes. Seems unlikely for a busy celebrity businessman and surely would have made the local newspaper, you would think. More likely Marconi sent him a letter, maybe in reply to a job application, and the rest is local legend perhaps.

My hunch, and I have only some contemporaneous evidence to back this up is that Artie did want to join the Marconi Company/ies, but he had first to qualify with the Post Master General’s certificate.

He was getting on a bit and at the age limit of 25 for joining Marconi, and couldn’t afford the course at either the Marconi School then in Liverpool or the British School of Telegraphy in Clapham London, so the local education committee made an exceptional bursary of the largest amount for that year so he could go to the British School of Telegraphy. That decision was made on 22nd September 1911 initially.

So we are back to square one on that issue then! It is not highly probable that Artie received a direct, rather than relayed, signal from Titanic, but it is possible via fluke of luck that Titanic's radio waves bounced off the ionosphere etc and down into his valley. Stranger things have happened. New Zealand is a lot further away from UK than Newfoundland is, about 5 times as far, with whole continents in between.

Edited By Hopper on 20/06/2023 04:07:16

.

I have not read every word of this thread; so please forgive me if this has been mentioned already:

**LINK**

https://historypoints.org/index.php?page=gelligroes-mill-pontllanfraith

States: [my emboldening]

The Moore family took over the mill in 1874 and supplied feed and seeds to farmers. In the early 20th century electricity generators were installed, using water power to charge batteries for local residents’ wireless sets. Artie experimented with radio technology and had his own receiver at the mill. He had another receiver on Mynyddislwyn, the high ground to the south east, where he would listen for messages from afar at night, when the radio signals carried further because of the lack of interference from sunlight.

So, perhaps not such a dusty environment as we might first imagine ?

MichaelG.

.

P.S. __ fact-checkers/myth-busters might like to work their way through this:

https://www.pressreader.com/uk/practical-wireless/20210311/281633897979862

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 20/06/2023 05:42:06

Despite the apparent misnomer in most reports …

This is probably the referenced book by Sir Oliver Lodge:

**LINK**

http://www.free-energy-info.tuks.nl/Lodge.pdf

MichaelG.

.

Edit: __ and it includes the Appendix, which is omitted from modern reprints 

Ref. https://rsgb.org/main/blog/publications/books-extra/2021/01/21/modern-views-of-electricity/

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 20/06/2023 06:18:34

Aah! The second radio. On the grassy knoll... The plot thickens.

Well spotted.

PS Well spotted indeed! The linked to Press Reader article seems the most comprehensive to date and does explain a lot more about the Titanic's radio, including it had previously transmitted to Port Said and Tennerife some 3,000 miles distant and that on the fatal night, the Marconi station at Cornwall received direct signals from Titanic. So entirely possible that Artie's rig up the hill from the mill picked up that same signal.

But yet again, no sources cited in the article. It is a general magazine article, not a scholarly paper so no surprise.

Julian, the author's email address is at the top of the article Michael linked to, and the article is only two years old so there is a pretty good chance you could contact him and perhaps find out his sources. (Sounds as though it comes back to the Artie Moore Am Radio Society yet once again, mentioned toward the end of the article. So contacting them directly may be the only way to really find out. The author may be able to tell you who he spoke to and share contact details.)

Edited By Hopper on 20/06/2023 06:30:46

Edited By Hopper on 20/06/2023 06:32:45

PPS, here is some background info on Scott Caldwell, author of the Press Reader article MG linked to. Should be enough there to track him down through his company or university. Or even the white pages or LinkedIn etc. LINK

It appears he is an experienced researcher (PhD) and writer so good chance his sources are good.

Edited By Hopper on 20/06/2023 06:44:00

Hi Hopper and Michael,

Thanks for the links.

I have to disagree about Scott Caldwell in respect of his article about Artie Moore. It merely regurgitates earlier inaccurate articles, and most significantly repeats the same errors. In essence what I stated in my first post of this thread.

Cheers,

Julian

Thanks for this thread Julian ! Having always had an interest in radio and the question of what was received and how, was 1912 a good year for skip conditions ? It seems strange that this story has not been a part of Titanic history bearing in mind how much has been written. Noel.

Regarding the model engine, and thereby the prize …

We may need some international co-operation here : **LINK**

https://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/webbin/serial?id=modelengelec

MichaelG.

Well, I did say that it sounds like it might get back - yet once again - to that Artie Moore Am Radio Assn. But there does seem to be more info in Caldwell's article on the radio distance aspect and other matters.

I wonder if anyone on the forum has a copy of the original ME article on Artie's model engine they can post? It was published in 1909, Volume 21, Issue 451, Page 585 under the byline of Arthur E Moore.

If sufficient detail is included it would be an interesting project to make a replica of the engine of the chap who is reputed to have received the Titanic's SOS and gone on to pioneer sonar.