Buying a Lathe Advice

> A reasonably competent machinist can produce accurate work on an older worn machine

Equally true about a modest imported machine built to a price.

I'm increasingly of the opinion that the real deciding factor has to be personal preference than anything else.

Neil

That was not the case with the metalwork class room I attended plus night classes, before the end of the class if you had been using a machine it was your job to clean the machine down and lubricate the slides and bed. It was not a good idea to bang tools into the chuck either else the slipper came out threat was enough the first time!

Kids these days have it far too easy and they know it.

Bob

Agree.

Buying a used lathe is a gamble unless you know a lot about used lathes. I've always wanted a Myford and now I have one. Was it the £500 bargain I thought it was? Surface finish is not what I expect so something, somewhere is probably not right - can you _know_ if the headstock bearings are adjusted correctly if you have never seen or experienced proper adjustment? I think I've got the Myford thing out of my system now, but I needed to. I'd probably feel dirty and inferior if I'd bought Chinese, but I wouldn't feel that way if I bought one now.

Unless you enjoy restoration projects (to the extent that is almost a priority over getting a good tool) or really know what you are doing, buy something 'as good as new': no play or 'rocking' anywhere; all slides and handles turn smooth and sweet, absolutely no sign of wear on the important bits. It should be clean and polished. It is much easier and safer to buy new and you can be up and running fast.

I'd work with the assumption that this is your first lathe, not your last.

Sounds like a man from the yahoo boxford group that recently bought a Harrison. Curiously I have never used a Harrison. Many others but not that one. Maybe it's because I have only been around toolrooms.

Those video's mentioned are a good place to go to listen to what a slightly worn gearhead sounds like on the Monarch. Slight signs of stage 1 headstock bearing wear when he is testing it for rather deep cuts too. Recutting when it shouldn't but maybe the tool moved. It is often easy to see the early signs of bearing wear. Crops up when bright drawn is being lightly skimmed with a fine feed. Rings appear along the work due to variations in hardness from the drawing process. Heavier cuts or much coarser feeds overcome this but when the tool is run back down the work it will cut again and not just due to the bar bending as it's being cut.

Accurate work worn out? Depends what can be put up with. I had to use a Taig/Peatol to make a mandrel to fit the Thomas dividing head. Due to earlier abuse forming one side of a V pulley in one cut the head had bent so the mandrel had about 0.005in taper so I corrected that by playing with the cross slide as the tool was run along the work. Finished up parallel to better than 0.0002in, no joints to be seen and as the bearings in these lathes are very solid and it was virtually new a very high class finish. It can be done but I don't want this sort of bother. If the bearings had been loose bang goes the finish. Curiously the person who stuck a gear blank I also turned up on the end of the mandrel and cut it for me had a Harrison - he was very impressed with the finish - better than he could do.

It doesn't really matter what people buy there will be various shades of good and bad about.

Maybe the lack of noise from a gearhead machine is an indication of how hard it's been used and for how long.I heard one Colchester on ebay that personally I wouldn't touch with a barge pole but even that might do decent work if the right sort of cuts are put on at the right time. Sometimes very heavy chucks can help a bit. A new class machine will just make a subdued humming noise. In fact the motor is likely to be noisier under very heavy loads.

I saw mention of 38mm bore and 3hp earlier. Some of that relates to how long it's going to take to reduce the size of parts and how many drills will be needed to drill large holes in stages . It also relates to the material being cut. Some tool steels for instance do need power unless rather light slow cuts are taken. This may be why tool room lathes are often worn also the amount of work some do. Going on elderly machines I have used bearings get to be a problem before the gear head makes much noise.

If people add files and emery etc none of the above matters but jobs will take longer. My Boxford (ME10) is pretty good but I feel it would benefit from new bearings. Mostly because I suspect no one has bothered to adjust them when needed. It will still do accurate work though. Go to gear heads an it would be interesting if lathes co uk mentioned if they were adjustable. I know of one Colchester that definitely isn't. Chipmaster and the 3,000rpm isn't good for that spindle size bearing set up as good as it is.

John

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What about a 'modern' boxford lathe. I bought a lovely sts250 with taper attachment for about £1.2k a few years ago. The best of both worlds, modern equipment, built to toolroom iso standards, sensible price. Something like this?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/boxford-lathe-ts-/191568812836?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2c9a641b24

Absolutely....

I have a Chester 9 x 20, a Sieg C3 Super and what looks to be a Warco 290 clone ( amongst others ) ....they all play their part......

I reckon the results achieved on a machine are down to the skill of the operator, although I'd agree that the machine does play a part...

A lot of valid comments on this. Now for a few more!

What lathe you choose depends on what you weant to do with it, (and looking to the future; because your horizons will expand as you gain confidence)

Years ago at the Worthing M E S Open Day, someone said "You can do small work on a big lathe, but you can't do big work on a small lathe"

An ex Industry lathe will have been worked hard for most of the time. It was bought to work and earn money for as much of the time, as possible.

An ex College/School lathe will not have seen as much use, but will have been abused. The Toolpost will probably have hit the chuck a few times, or the auto traverse abused and the shear pin been asked to do its job.

A new modern Eastern lathe may well have hardened bedways. Imperial dials/leadscrews may well be harder to find, but recent bikes will be metric anyway.

You may be able to find a fairly recent belt driven "Amateur" lathe in reasonable condition, not having been asked to take deep cuts at high feed rates, for days on end.

(Here, I am thinking terms of Warco BH600, Warco BH900, Chester Craftsman or possibly an Engineers ToolRoom BL12/24) All these are similar, with belt drive headstocks, with power cross feed from a Norton box, so less messing about with changewheels, to cut a wide variety of threads. These have a MT5 mandrel, so will pass upto 38mm. (One of the reasons, that I changed from a Myford ML7)

Geared Head models will be noisier than belt driven.

Older machines, even if mechanically good, may not have the speed range to get the best use from indexable carbide tools.

If you consider buying a second hand machine, with a three phase motor, it may be cheaper to buy an inverter than to a new single phase motor. Luxury, is to have a dual voltage three phase motor, with Variable Spee Drive via an Invertor. (My BL12/24 has a 1.5hp motor with VFD and I rarely find the need to take off more then 0.100" a side in one cut)

Belt drive has one advantage, the belt will slip if everything really jams. Plus belts are cheaper and quicker to replace than broken gears - if you can get them.

Ultimately, as Neil says, it is down to personal choice, and budget.

As an Apprentice, I fell in love with a 21" swing Dean Smith and Grace, but have not space or money for one, so my coat is cut according to my cloth.

Howard

Wise words Howard and eloquently spoken....

Couldn't agree more..