Does this have a name?

I've come across a water service valve buried in house wall. It's an isolation for exterior tap, and the only access (without pulling wall apart) is down a small hole perhaps 10mm diameter.

Rather than the standard screwdriver slot to twist the ball, this valve has a raised bar across a rounded dimple.

I speculate that the key/tool to operate it would look like

I've searched on-line for similar valves, or the tool to operate, but have failed to find anything. Does anyone here know a name for valves of this type? or where I can get a key?

I can make a key, but will be largely guesswork as measuring down the access hole is not easy.

Edited By David Jupp on 20/11/2022 17:04:10

Sounds like it might be a 1/4 turn plug cock. Age will determine whether anything is available commercially but I would suggest that it's not recent. When I was working I came across them occasionally as the drain valve for a hot water cylinder and not really suited for high pressure applications, i.e mains water.

Martin

Martin,

Thanks - I'm pretty sure it is a 1/4 turn ball valve, similar to the ones that have a screwdriver slot. I can just make out compression fitting at one side of the valve when peering down the hole in the wall.

I was hoping to find either a key, or details of the valve that I could measure/estimate sizes from to make my own key.

That sounds more like the sort of coupling you would find on a motorised valve. I wonder if somone repurposed the valve part of a motorised assembly?

Robert G8RPI.

If you can get to the pipe from inside the house, then fit a new valve where you can get at it.

Disturbing an old valve buried inside a wall as asking for trouble.

I fully agree with Dave Halford, do not think about turning it. Years ago when fitting central heating to my bungalow, I found the main stopcock in the path didn't want to turn fully off, and I broke it off. I changed the stopcock inside the house with a trickle of water running, helped immensely by the old nut and olive fitting the new tap. The broken stopcock was 2 feet below the surface in a 4" diameter hole. The tap handle had broken at the square end of the brass shaft leaving about an inch projecting. I rushed out to a very good local tool shop and bought set of three 1/2" drive stud extractors, the type that look like a long socket with internal rollers and a 12" extension. Together with my extensions, one of the extractors fitted and turned the stopcock back on. Years later a new main was pushed through about 4 feet deep for all the houses and a brand new plastic stopcock was fitted, all without digging a trench through 120 yards of front gardens, clever, these water board guys are, I thought.

Dave / Old Mart,

The valve is inside a boxed in section of wall just inside the property. There is already a hole for a valve key in the board over the pipe/valve. As the valve is inside (and assuming it to be a 1/4 turn) valve, it is unlikely to have seized - if it has that will become obvious when I attempt (carefully) to turn it.

Replacing the valve would require removing/replacing the boarding, and consequent re-decorating - hence I'd like to try closing the valve through the access hole that was clearly put there for that purpose. It's a pity no key was provided!

I don't think the valve being inside has any effect on whether it's seized or not. What matters is the nature of your water, hard soft etc, and - most of all - how long it's been since the valve was last moved.

When my interior stop-cock seized I was able to force it closed but the cock twisted on it's compression fittings, damaged the pipes, and both joints started to drip. I managed to fix that by retightening, but it left the pipes in a precarious state. About a year later, I had to turn off the stop cock again, and the same thing happened except it was impossible to stop the leaks. Fitting a new stop-cock to cleaned up pipes became a nightmare when it turned out the incoming plastic pipe needed an imperial top-hat gland that's unobtainium. (being a metric fanboy, I used 'industrial language' on the idiot who had decided in the early 1970s it was OK to make a modern pipe and seal system in imperial rather than going metric; it seems the imperial version didn't last long, making spare parts hard to find, turning a straightforward job into a pig.

I agree it's worth a try. However, I recommend preparing for the worst! Don't attempt it when the shops are closed, you don't have the right tools, and plumbers are on strike!

Dave

Please can we keep this on topic? I'm aware of the risks of seized valves (I judge it unlikely - I could be wrong, risk is on my own head. This is NOT a stop cock - it's a service valve (1/4 turn ball valve)). I do know where the stop cock is, and that isn't seized.

All I'm looking for is if anyone knows a name/term that might help to find a similar valve or the matching key via a search engine (as everything I tried had failed).

I'll probably end up choosing a few different diameter rods from my scrap box, round one end in the lathe, cut a slot with hacksaw then go to site and file to adjust.

David

Although I have never seen one quite like you describe … I suspect you have a ‘tamper-proof’ valve which has been usefully re-purposed.

Conceptually similar to the one discussed here: **LINK**

https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/tamper-proof-angle-stops-argh.36826/

… but obviously differing in detail.

Think of all those annoying screws on modern electrical appliances, or of all the variations on car wheel-nut design.

.

I think ‘reverse engineering’ a key for what you have is probably the best bet.

MichaelG.

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Edited after more careful reading of your opening post.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 21/11/2022 10:02:52

Please forgive a slight digression …

Here is a quite informative ‘advertorial’ about ball-valves in general: **LINK**

https://theengineeringmindset.com/the-basics-of-ball-valves-explained/

MichaelG.