Choosing between two engines

Before I go any further I have put an "Introducing myself" post up but it's awaiting moderation!

My very modest workshop has just a Myford ML7 and a Walker Turner pillar drill, I have no space for a mill (or budget!). For my first Model Engineering project I am currently debating either the Stuart S50 or the Stuart 10H. Both appeal in their own ways. The S50 has more physical size, which I think is nice, and I think a bigger bore and stroke so may be more suited to "doing work" in the future. However the more compact dimensions of the 10H may make it more suitable for machining using my more modest equipment, and not having an overhung crank does appeal. I would prefer a horizontal engine to a vertical engine, partially because I prefer the looks but also because machining the upright sections looks like it my be a bit beyond me at first!

Can I ask which of the two people engines stated people think would be more suited to making using only my ML7? I have been watching Keith Appleton's videos and I think my filing should be ok for some of the less critical parts and dimensions (MoD apprenticeship at Boscombe Down many years ago!). If there is another possible engine type that would be in my budget, either Stuart or from another manufacturer, I would welcome your suggestions.

I would welcome any opinions; so far the only engine I have built was a flame gulper I made as a child out of scraps scrounged from my grandads workshop whenever he wasn't looking. I'm aware the debate around the small Stuart engines is quite often talked about but I couldn't find any info on which would be more suitable to a mill-less build.

Thanks very much in advance.

With a vertical slide your ML7 should be capable of doing most of the models from Stuarts. There is probably more on the net or in book form about building the 10 series engines so that may have a bearing on which you go for. If you have a look on youtube there is a series and also Harold Hall has a long series on his site.

The S50 has a longer stroke so better suited to slower speeds than the 10 series but similar capacities. You can see a bit more of what is going on on the S50 so a bit more interesting as just a display model.

+1 for what Jason says.

You don't even need a vertical slide to build a 10V or 10H, even the S50 although you may need to hand-finish things like the flat surfaces of the baseplate by careful filing.

Neil

Many thanks, I do have a vertical slide but haven't actually used it before. Thats largely why I'm doing this; to improve my knowledge and skills. Thanks for your advice.

My turning instructor spent the war years on capstans. He made his cigarette lighter (rectangular) whilst on nights, by holding work in the toolpost with an end mill in the chuck.

So, with a Vertical Slide on your ML7 you can do milling work, (as long as you don't want to take off 50 thou in one pass!) In my experience ML7 + V S is not particularly rigid, but you cut your coat (or in this case, metal) to suit cloth, (machine).

Go for it!

Howard

Hi Jon,

I went for the Stuart 10v as my first go at this great hobby and am enjoying it immenslel when I get time to work on it. Some of the tasks seemed soooo daunting at first but with great advice from here it is slowly coming on.

Yup, did have to get a new bed casting when I misread the drawing but as my old dad used to say, 'You've got to pay to learn'....

Not sure where you are in N Dorset but we are in Broadmayne about 3 miles from Dorchester and you are welcome to pop by and use my Warco WM18 mill if it helps you out on some of your parts when you get started.

Kettle is always on too...

Best regards and welcome to the nut house.....

Martin

The Stuart Turner catalogue I bought at the show today says the 10H "is another excellent project for the beginner which can be successfully completed on a 3 1/2 inch lathe"

If you are going to steam your model, think about the cost / size of a boiler to match your engine. Steaming your engine after hours of construction work can be so rewarding.
BobH

Thanks chaps, I'm in Gillingham, so about an hour from you Martin, your hospitality is welcomed and may just be taken up on; thank you.

Howard; I'd heard the same about the rigidity of the VS, but as you say I think it's a matter of going gently. However this is the reason I was favouring the 10H; smaller bed to machine.

Nige, thats excellent news; I suspect it will be the 10H I go for. I like the look of the 10V but prefer a horizontal. Maybe when I make a steam launch I'll make a vertical setup.

Speedy Builder; the intention in the longer run is to make a boiler as well; my grandfather was a boiler maker/inspector among other things so have some great advice to draw from there. I like the idea of a cornish/lancashire style. All part of the fun is the drama of building up steam. To start with however I'll see about running on compressed air. I can run an engine without a boiler, but a boiler on its own may be a little redundant! I'm enjoying the process of researching it. I'd like to make a boiler that is suitable for any future models I may make; this means I may end up making something a little over the top for my first model but that future proofs me for things I make later.

My eventual goal would be to make something along the lines of a scale Foden overtype steam wagon, but I still haven't decided yet. I've got a long time before I need to decide...

Thanks for the warm welcome, and the advice is gratefully received.