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Strength of Beams

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Hopper12/09/2020 12:23:43
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Posted by Sam Longley 1 on 11/09/2020 13:00:24:
Posted by Michael Gilligan on 11/09/2020 08:25:52:
Posted by Sam Longley 1 on 11/09/2020 07:54:51:

Just one point-- They are not normally circular holes but hexagonal. That gives flat surfaces for the weld at the new meeting point.

.

I suppose that would depend upon one’s definitions of ‘they’ and ‘normally’

As I mentioned yesterday:

_____

Here’s an interesting page:

**LINK**

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 10/09/2020 21:34:21

_____

MichaelG.

The example you refer to with circular holes is not what I was referring to. If one wants to put a cut along the web of a beam then separate the 2 halves & offset & then re weld to form a deeper castellated beam one needs an edge to weld to. If the line was a wavey one the meeting points would not meet in a way which could be suitably welded & the holes would NOT be circular. Standard castellated beams cut from a simple I beam would be cut such that the line has flat edges for the weld. The hexagonal hole thus remaining would still leave room for services & I do not recall having difficulty installing them. I did fit quite a few tonnes of the stuff in a number of new schools halls etc But I do confess, that was 40 years ago & things move on, so If I am wrong then I stand corrected

The example in the one in the link would , presumably, be cut from an I beam with considerable waste.

Less waste than you might think when you look at the cunning way they are made with modern CNC cutting gear.

celbeam.jpg

Martin Kyte12/09/2020 12:28:08
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3445 forum posts
62 photos

. . . and as I said less weld too.

regards Martin

SillyOldDuffer12/09/2020 21:26:39
10668 forum posts
2415 photos

Here's how Fusion 360 predicted three 60mm long Aluminium beams of equal cross-sectional area and length would deflect with a 250N load on the end.

Winner is tube, 13mm od, 11.34mm id, deflects 0.06mm

2nd square section 10x10mm, deflects 0.17mm

3rd round bar, 11.28mm diameter, deflects 0.22mm

beamsbendingf360fem.jpg

Deflection is magnified above reality in the image to emphasie it. The colours indicate degree of deflection, not safety. Red highlights points of maximum deflection, not that the structure is going to break. Another FEM reports shows the structure has a 7x safety factor.

Although tube is stronger weight for weight than box or rod, the fact doesn't help us design a better boring bar because the diameter of the tube is bigger, and boring bars have to fit into small holes! Other structures make good use of tubes.

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 12/09/2020 21:27:54

Alan Waddington 212/09/2020 21:46:23
537 forum posts
88 photos
Posted by Hopper on 12/09/2020 12:23:43:
Posted by Sam Longley 1 on 11/09/2020 13:00:24:
Posted by Michael Gilligan on 11/09/2020 08:25:52:
Posted by Sam Longley 1 on 11/09/2020 07:54:51:

Just one point-- They are not normally circular holes but hexagonal. That gives flat surfaces for the weld at the new meeting point.

.

I suppose that would depend upon one’s definitions of ‘they’ and ‘normally’

As I mentioned yesterday:

_____

Here’s an interesting page:

**LINK**

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 10/09/2020 21:34:21

_____

MichaelG.

The example you refer to with circular holes is not what I was referring to. If one wants to put a cut along the web of a beam then separate the 2 halves & offset & then re weld to form a deeper castellated beam one needs an edge to weld to. If the line was a wavey one the meeting points would not meet in a way which could be suitably welded & the holes would NOT be circular. Standard castellated beams cut from a simple I beam would be cut such that the line has flat edges for the weld. The hexagonal hole thus remaining would still leave room for services & I do not recall having difficulty installing them. I did fit quite a few tonnes of the stuff in a number of new schools halls etc But I do confess, that was 40 years ago & things move on, so If I am wrong then I stand corrected

The example in the one in the link would , presumably, be cut from an I beam with considerable waste.

Less waste than you might think when you look at the cunning way they are made with modern CNC cutting gear.

celbeam.jpg

I think castellated beams traditionally had hexagonal holes, because they were hand burned using an oxy acetylene torch. Straight lines are easier to burn by hand than circles. They bend like bananas when cut, we used to tack them together in a jig using metal wedges to straighten the halves back up.

Roger Best12/09/2020 22:22:03
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406 forum posts
56 photos

smiley Nice to see some engineering discussion.

How about suggesting what frequency the tool will resonate at and what surface finish will result?

Robert Atkinson 212/09/2020 22:33:54
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1891 forum posts
37 photos

I'm a bit late to this but a couple of points

on "Computers" I highly recommend the Film "Hidden Figures" Even SWMBO liked it.

Boring bars also require torsional stiffness. I beams have poor torsional stiffness.

Elliptical and teardrop tubes are used on aircraft in place or round for aerodynamic reasons not structural

When I worked for a acttual aircraft manufacturer (Norman Aeroplane Company, sheet metal in one end of the factory, aircraft out the other) in the mid 80's they still calculated stress, strain and strength manually (with calculators). No finite element analysis like Nastran. The critical structures like wings were then tested to ultimate (failure). The boss, Desmond Norman, would be very unhappy if the caluulaed and actual ultimate loads were out by more than a few percent.

Robert G8RPI.

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