Looking for information - advice etc.
Chris Trice | 16/01/2011 02:41:35 |
![]() 1376 forum posts 10 photos | Sand and lathes, not the best combination. You can still buy genuine black wrinkle finish paint.
I've got a early Cowells ME. Absolutely first class for quality but don't expect to remove metal at a particularly high rate. It starts to struggle with work over about 1 1/2" inches in diameter. It has backgear and all the changewheels for thread cutting, in fact good versatility all round but definitely more for small models and items. Very transportable though if you move around a lot.
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Tony Borland | 16/01/2011 03:20:42 |
6 forum posts | Thanks Chris for the info posted on the Cowells.How would it go machining Brass Tube with OD-85mm/ID-58mm x 22mm Width?Machining 5mm of the inside/outside and width of the Brass Tube?
I have only seen pictures of the Cowells at there website.The Tailstock looks like it sits on a small metal plate.Could the Headstock & Tailstock use Riser Blocks to add 1" to the swing.Just a thought.
Do you use your for model building?
Cheers.....Tony |
Chris Trice | 16/01/2011 14:53:43 |
![]() 1376 forum posts 10 photos | It'll take you all day to remove that much metal because you couldn't apply more than the lightest cut without the motor grinding to a halt. It's a lathe designed for watchmakers and small precision instrumentation. The belts are only 1/4" wide (if that) and also prone to slip when heavily loaded. The tailstock, like most good lathes, can be adjusted sideways for taper turning. That's the 'plate' you probably think you see. It's just not worth the effort of riser blocks because increasing the diameter capacity of the lathe just makes things worse. In my honest opinion, you'll be cursing that you didn't buy a bigger lathe if you buy a Cowells for this class of work. It's superb for what it's designed for but don't fall into the trap most people do of trying to make a lathe machine work way above its design. You'd be far better off with something like an EMCO Compact 5 for that size of work. You can pick those up in excellent condition second hand for around £500. Well built and versatile, a Compact 5 can still easily be lifted and moved around by one person even if it's to tuck out the way or to put on a shelf. It has roughly twice the size capacity of a Cowells and much nearer to what you need. Edited By Chris Trice on 16/01/2011 14:56:27 |
Chris Trice | 16/01/2011 15:00:59 |
![]() 1376 forum posts 10 photos | http://www.lathes.co.uk/emco/page2.html |
Chris Trice | 16/01/2011 15:04:54 |
![]() 1376 forum posts 10 photos | .... And I use my Cowells for small animatronic components. I bought it for its portability but also bought a Compact 5 for the same reason and it's much greater capacity to replace the Cowells due to the frustrations I've outlined. Edited By Chris Trice on 16/01/2011 15:05:27 |
IanT | 16/01/2011 15:52:28 |
2147 forum posts 222 photos | Hi Tony,
Any lathe will have what you might call an ideal "range" - so if your needs include a very wide range of material sizes to be machined - then one machine may not meet them all.
The Cowells for instance is a 1.75" x 8" lathe (88.9mm x 203mm) lathe and is often described as a "minature lathe". Some versions can run up to 4,000 rpm - very useful for some fine drilling operations. It would tend to be more useful for "watchmaking" than a larger lathe - and if your modelling included a great deal of 'watchmaking' sized operations, then it might be ideal. Since you wish to turn OD 85mm brass - then with a total swing of 89mm - this is probably not the one for you.
The EW should handle this however - as I'm sure most other larger lathes would also do, including the EMCO. It's Horses for Courses. There is also the small matter of cost.
Chris make a good point about how much metal you can remove with a smaller lathe - but "all day" might be an exageration. Rex Tingey (of Unimat fame) used to recommend that a hacksaw was a very useful accessory for a Unimat - and he used to roughly cut away unwanted material before he started to machine down to final finish dimensions. I find this very good advice and have been known to do the same (even on work being done on the Myford S7).
I've started to strip the EW down for cleaning and rust removal - but will set some shots up to give you an idea.
Regards,
Ian T
PS Ruaidhri - I'll get some more MC articles to you before too long. |
IanT | 16/01/2011 17:11:18 |
2147 forum posts 222 photos | Hi Tony,
I've posted some photos as promised. Please note that these pictures are ALL posed - I was starting to strip the lathe down, so I've just placed things in postion (mostly) to give you some idea of what the tool is capable of.
Showing my crude (but useable countershaft and the backgear arrangement. The change wheel quadrant is not fitted. I have a full set of (steel) change wheels though. And yes, the wiring will be tidied up and everything enclosed! The ER32 collett chuck works well - the diamond tool (from my Myford) is a bit big and therefore has limited travel - but is easy to sharpen and gives an excellent finish. Didn't actually fit them - but you can see that the boring table and vertical slide (with the ER chuck) will provide a useful milling facility for small parts I mentioned this in an earlier post I think - but here is the Gauge 3 'Sterling' driving wheel leaning against the EW 5" faceplate. The casting is 118mm in diameter and in backgear with a tipped tool - I think I could turn this on the EW if I had to. I'd probably use a mandrel mounted in the collet chuck though.. So I hope this gives you some idea of what a potentially useful small machine the EW is and why I think it would be just fine for the majority of your modelling needs.
Regards,
Ian T |
Chris Trice | 16/01/2011 22:40:55 |
![]() 1376 forum posts 10 photos | Ian speaks wisely. The EW looks like it's more than up to the job.
Metal removal speed should be considered though. For making one offs, it's not such an issue if it takes a bit longer to machine a component but if you have several of an item to make (and it sounds like you have that in mind), it will rapidly become very long winded and tedious. It's one of those things you may only appreciate when you come to use a larger lathe that zips effortlessly through the same job in a third of the time.
The concept of a size range is also worth noting. At the other end of the scale, you wouldn't want to make watch components on a big Harrison. |
Ruaidhri Murphy | 17/01/2011 13:15:09 |
![]() 37 forum posts 1 photos | I won't teach my granny to suck eggs here - most of my turning life has been with wood - only got the Myford a few years ago and am still trying to become a beginner ![]() On the subject of the crinkle paint - can't be had for love or money in Ireland - and can't get a supplier to post aerosols. Unless someone has any bright ideas I'll test out the sand idea on some waste. Bearing in mind that it will be dusted on to wet varnish, then sprayed/painted over, it should (??) be fairly well locked in. As mentioned elsewhere, I am Irish, so expect some of my cunning plans to have the effect of raising the hair on Baldric's head ![]() Couple of pics added to Picasa Album The newspaper underneath lends an elegant touch (SWMBO likes her dining room table!). Finally - I'd be interested if anyone knows where I can get a couple of the handles re-chromed CHEAP. Again I'm afraid our little republic (??) leaves something to be desired. Fond regards, Edited By Ruaidhri Murphy on 17/01/2011 13:17:34 Edited By Ruaidhri Murphy on 17/01/2011 13:18:55 |
Terryd | 17/01/2011 15:00:41 |
![]() 1946 forum posts 179 photos | Hi Ruaidhr, This Italian company has a website in English and will supply cans of a decent wrinkle finish paint, not sure about pricing but perhaps worth a try. Best regards Terry |
IanT | 17/01/2011 17:07:43 |
2147 forum posts 222 photos | That's beginning to look a lot better Ruaidhri!
Interesting to see the original countershaft in more detail. If I need better bearings (than the plain 'Picadors') I might build a Mark 2 C/S and that looks like a neat arrangement - how does the "tensioner" work do you think?.
BTW - If you do have the original motor and pulleys - I'd be interested in what you think the original available "speeds" were (as sold). I'm probably running mine a bit fast.
Regards,
IanT |
Ruaidhri Murphy | 17/01/2011 18:40:54 |
![]() 37 forum posts 1 photos | Terry, Checked that out (thanks). €73 per can of non-aerosol, and needs oven baking. Having nearly killed SWMBO's last microwave * during a wood seasoning 'experiment' I dare not do the same with the cooker ![]() Ian, Not sure about the tensioner yet - I'm very much on a wing and a prayer here ![]() Haven't got the motor yet, but I can measure up the pulleys if you don't mind waiting a day or two - my woodturning classes are about to start & I have students ringing & calling every ### five minutes. Also need to get blanks, fittings etc. organised. And an article on "design considerations - catenary curves" to write up for our newsletter on Thursday. And a tailstock to fix for a mate. And ....... I thought retirement was supposed to be feet up and relax!! Cheers, Ruaidhrí * You can season wood really quickly in a microwave. Trick is NOT to answer the front door to chatty friend in the middle of the proceedings - couldn't see from one side of the kitchen to the other. ![]() |
Keith Long | 17/01/2011 19:06:08 |
883 forum posts 11 photos | Hi Ruaidhrí 2 possibilities for getting the paint - do you know anyone traveling to and fro by ferry who could buy a few aerosols in the UK and take them over to you, or ask one of the suppliers here to ship to you by courier. As far as I know the problem is that normal small parcels would go air freight which is the NO NO for aerosols. Surface transport should be OK as I assume you can buy other aerosol products there. I don't know where you've tried over there but do you have any car restoration places you could have a word with, that's one of the bigger markets for the stuff here - re-finishing dash panels and instrument housings. Keith |
Ruaidhri Murphy | 19/01/2011 01:01:22 |
![]() 37 forum posts 1 photos | Thanks Keith - I'll look into having a nephew pick some up before his next visit to the Oul Sod (Ireland , that is, not me - although it could well apply!!). Checked out car restorers. bike restorers. I have a 2000 Jag XJ8 and nobody in the club has any ideas either. Crinkle paint and good quality chroming seem to be something we Irish can't get to grips with ![]() Luckily I've gotten sidetracked sorting out GHT's attachment to allow use of the Myford dividing head on the headstock (nearly there - just to turn the taper and slot the collar for the spindle) so I'm not at a loose end. Cheers for now, Ruaidhrí |
Tony Borland | 01/02/2011 15:05:11 |
6 forum posts | Thanks IanT for the advice and pictures.Lets see if i can now find a EW Lathe for sale.
Best Regards
Tony |
WALLACE | 02/02/2011 12:43:31 |
304 forum posts 17 photos | You can get a pretty good gloss wrinkle finnish by spraying with Hammerite, leaving it for 24 hours and then giving it another coat (as what it says NOT to do on the tin !). It worked well for me - this was with a spray gun mind mind - usining the recomended thinners. Might need a bit of trial and error depending on technique, ambiant temperature etc.
w. |
IanT | 03/02/2011 16:10:11 |
2147 forum posts 222 photos | I don't see them advertised too often Tony - but I'm sure there must be a few around.
It's possible they are being passed around in 'Modelling' circles as treasured possessions. They are a good sized little lathe for any railway or marine modeller.
Why not try the ME "Wanted" list on here - maybe an Model 'Engineer' will have moved up in lathe sizes and has an EW lying around not doing too much these days?
Worth a try & doesn't cost anything either. Perfect!
![]() Regards,
Ian T |
Ruaidhri Murphy | 04/02/2011 22:29:23 |
![]() 37 forum posts 1 photos | Nearly ready to get back in action again chaps ![]() Away looking after grandkids - and evicted (with Sheila) while the two lads paint the house for us - inside and out!!! No way was I turning down an offer like that. Hoping to get back to the EW next week after I've gotten blanks & stuff readu for woodturning students. I'll bang up pics as work progresses and, once again, thanks for all the help and advice. Fond regards, Ruaidhrí |
Keith Long | 10/02/2011 14:34:03 |
883 forum posts 11 photos | Hello All EW owners I've recently acquired an EW lathe - or at least part of one - bed, cross and top slides, headstock, spindle and lead screw, and subsequently manged to source a tail-stock of the correct pattern for the age of the bed. My original reason for getting the lathe bed, was to incorporate it into a tool grinder, but when I collected it and saw the tail-stock on offer separately, it became a restoration project! It even looks as though an old chuck and backplate picked up on the off chance about 12 months ago will fit as well! The bed on my lathe is the pattern with the extension to the tail-stock end and it has a gap, so from lathes.co.uk it looks like a fairly late version. However I could do with a bit of information about these lathes however before I go much further. I'm missing the back gear bracket, shaft and gears, although I've got the necessary gears on the main spindle, so that looks like a manufacturing job. But looking at the pictures that you've posted and those on the lathes.co.uk website I can't see any signs of a clutch any where in the lead-screw so it looks as though thread cutting under power could be "interesting" especially up to a shoulder. Do your machines have such a clutch and I've just not spotted, it or will this be an "owners modification" that I wish to carry out. At the moment I don't have any change wheels for the EW but I do have loads for my Drummonds which at 14 dp rather than 16 dp are too big on the face of it but if I incorporate a clutch, then that has to go somewhere, and I think the easiest would be to move the change wheels further to the left of the headstock and make up a suitable banjo and mounting to suit with the clutch between the change wheel array and the end of the lead-screw. - I don't want to modify any original parts if can avoid it. Any advice or comments will be most welcome. This machine is too good to mess about, it deserves to be restored and set up as a lathe! Keith |
IanT | 10/02/2011 14:49:09 |
2147 forum posts 222 photos | Hi Keith - and welcome to the EW Owners Club!
![]() The EW had no clutch fitted as such - the leadscrew is permanently engaged as built. This was addressed by Martin Cleeve in his ME articles on "upgrading" the EW by modifying the leadscrew and fitting a dog-clutch. This has the added advantage of helping screwcut more easily - as you don't need a thread gauge on the leadscrew to pick up a thread correctly. MC was a big fan of (single tooth) dog clutches for this reason alone.
We (the other members of this exclusive club) have been sharing information off-line - and if you would like to read the MC articles for instance - that can be arranged.
Suggest you email me if you want to know more.
Regards,
Ian T
PS I know Ruaidhri - I guess you would liike the other bits scanned too? |
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