Colchester Student 3100 VS

Hi David,

Yes overstocked and little cash....I just took a look too

Gary

Well Gary, guess that’s good news for you if you win, as it won’t need disconnecting, and they must have the facilities to lift it straight on to transport..........if you hired a tiltbed trailer with a winch, you could gently roll it off at home with no bother. Usually less than £100 to hire.

Another possibility for moving machinery; some years ago I sold a 5 ton milling machine and left it to the buyer to sort out moving it.

He turned up with a skip truck, without the skip, and used the lifting arms with chains to lift the miller onto the platform at the back where the skip would normally sit. Took minutes to load and he was away!

Brian

Gary

In a nutshell, yes.

The bank has a charge on them for a £50k loan too.

The company was dormant for many years, had a change of directors 18 months or so ago (It looks like it changed ownership from parents to children), and in the period since then have been on a buying spree for stock, and I reckon have overstretched themselves - probably the bank behind the selloff.

I live local to the machine tool dealer and know them quite well. When managing the company i worked for, have dealt with them over the years in both buying and selling. Location both in Tameside and when in Oldham. They have always had a decent reputation for buying and supplying good straight machines. Both the machine tool fitter and electrician they use I have also used and which are well respected.

In fact i bought my current M300 ( in my gallery ) from them as a negotiated cash deal. They have always carried a decent supply reputation. They use contractors for transport who obviously are well versed in handling machine tolols and there is always the possibility they could put their contact details your way. I used them to drop my machine off.

Like with all machine tool dealers, a lot depends on where in the purchase to sale the machine is at. By this i mean when they purchase a machine there may well be faults or it may just be good to go. So how far to being suitable for retail in good to go is always the purchasers gamble prior to buying/bidding.

As for the variable speed Colchester Student I cannot comment specifically but only what I know generally about the variable speed models in particular the Harrisons. The Harrison VS330tr which is the variable speed toolroom version of the M300 has been known to be problematic in industry, can be expensive to correct and be far more difficult to convert to 240v inverter control.

I also think you will find that the variable speed Student will have the same dimensions as the Student 1800 for steadies etc. So check that out if successful.

I took a punt when both a nearly new fixed steady and travelling steady appeared on Ebay for the Harrison VS330tr at an absolutely low BIN price and they fitted the M300 perfectly when they arrived - result.

Morning David,

Strange how the company was dormant for so long. They must have traded under a different name before.

"The company was dormant for many years, had a change of directors 18 months or so ago (It looks like it changed ownership from parents to children), and in the period since then have been on a buying spree for stock, and I reckon have overstretched themselves - probably the bank behind the selloff. "

I totally agree with this statement. Will see - I am just going to set myself a limit and see where we go.

​Its not perfect, would have preferred Gap Bed, but I guess that wasn't an option due to the speed, would have preferred a longer bed.....I will live with it for a while if it turns out ok, no tooling offered

Will have to be on the look out for this. According to Tony's website the tooling is interchangeable with the standard Student 1800 - I will need to be sure the chucks are OK at that top end speed, not that I will use it up there that often.

Gary

Really interesting thread providing lots of info about buying a big lathe by auction. Please keep it coming.

Picking up on the reason the lathe is being sold by auction:

1. It might be because, as David suggests, a dealer has over-stocked and needs a quick sale to raise cash. Possibly creditors have forced the sale, explaining why the seller isn't offering it as a deal himself to avoid his share of the auction fees. If this is the reason, then the lathe could be an absolute bargain for an absolute beginner. Bought by a dealer who knows what to look for, cleaned up, and then auctioned to raise cash quickly or because he needs the storage space.
2. A more sinister alternative is that a dealer has found the lathe to be in poor order and is selling by auction to get what he can without taking responsibility for the lathes condition. Note that the auction description does not make any claims whatever about condition and the Ts&Cs say: The lot(s)/goods are sold as they lie with all or any faults. No goods sold “as new”. You shall be deemed to have inspected and approved the lot(s)/goods. If You buy without prior inspection You shall be deemed to have done so at your own risk. Any statutory or other warranty, condition, description or representation expressed or implied as to the state, quality or fitness of the lot(s)/goods subject to this contract, is to the extent permitted by applicable law hereby expressly excluded. If they're dumping the lathe, it's not a bargain unless you get it cheap and can fix it yourself without breaking the bank.

Is it possible to go and see it?

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 24/11/2017 12:19:45

Hi Dave,

Interesting comments. However whilst I take your point about off-loading machines due to being in poor order, there is a large number being sold so he would have had to have bought a lot of c--p. Not to say he hasn't! Hopefully will find out.

I can't be bothered to get on the car and drive up there from here, at least not for the money I am prepared to take a punt for on this machine - I will take a chance.....what could possibly go wrong??????

Worst  case I will strip it, and sell it for spares like everyone else, they seem to sell at such ridiculous prices, I might be able to make a small business out of it.  HI HI

Gary

Edited By Absolute Beginner on 24/11/2017 12:28:07

Hi Gary,

Fascinating subject. I'm glad you started the thread : it's the first I've seen that's gone quite so comprehensively into the subject. I've learned a lot already. I like to think I'm careful with Terms and Conditions and I didn't spot David's 39%.

I hope it works out. It's a really nice lathe and will have cost a bomb new. Could easily be the bees knees.

I like your realistic attitude to risk. I'm not sure a man taking a calculated punt who also has a worst-case fallback plan should really describe himself as an 'Absolute Beginner' .

Looking forward to developments!

Cheers,

Dave

Is this too big for you gary?

**LINK**

Hi Ian,

I hate to sy it is but I guess it is really!

When I start looking at 7.5hp motors I can't help but feel its starting to get silly for my needs.

I am even struggling with justifying 5hp. I am trying to research how easy or difficult it might be to change motors out to around 3HP, that might give me a greater option of decent machines....at least at what I might consider to be the right cost.

Thank you for thing of me Ian, Gary

Just missed the final bidding.

Anybody see what it went for pls?

Well I have certainly learnt a few things today, ref the on line auction. I don't really think their are bargains to be had.

Having spoken with one of the auctioneers I discovered the machines all have reserves on them. It was also interesting to note that most of the machines in the action were also listed on West Point Machine tools website as discussed earlier in the thread

From the prices listed for sale its not rocket science to work out that the reserve price is going to be close to the for sale price on their website.

I was bidding on the VS3100, the XYZ 1400 and the Master 2500, which has only just finished. the one thing I will say is that I like the idea of the auction being extended by 10 mins each time a bid is placed within 10 mins of end, stops bid sniping

The VS 3100 finished at £2300, the XYZ at £1500, and the Master at £2100, I bet none of them are sold as I can't imagine they would have reached their reserve price

Gary

Edited By Absolute Beginner on 28/11/2017 16:46:49

Edited By Absolute Beginner on 28/11/2017 16:49:16

Thanks for the great feedback Gary.

Malc

Dont forget: The listed prices on their web site are plus 20% Vat

Yes Malc,

And we have to remember the prices bid for the auction are + 39% ish

Gary

Have to agree, there were no bargains to be had in that particular sale.........i have had bargains in the past though, from factory liquidation type auctions. AFAiK there were no reserves set when i bid in the past, that was with Apex.

Yeh, have seen the calcs in earlier posts. At £2300 plus the 39% it still looked a good price, as the lathe looks to be a nice one, but like you mention about the possibility there was large reserve, so no deal.

I have been used to buying for my works in the past, usually from companies that have been in liquidation where most equipment had no reserves, so the only real consideration was the buyers premium. Occasionally the equipment would probably had avreserve where it was still owned by a lease company.

Vat was then not an issue like it is for private buyers. Maybe worth only looking at liquidation sales really.

Anyways Gary, good luck with your search.

I Would have to agree liquidation auctions are probably a good bet for a bargain, where no reserves are in place.

Unfortunately, even though it would appear that the company who was in fact auctioning the equipment, on paper do not appear to be in good shape, the equipment definitely had reserve prices on at this stage and so were not great bargains in my opinion.

Whilst I agree that £2300 + 39% is a good price for us enthusiasts, I would suggest that the actual lathe was in fact not sold.

Anyway....lets all keep keep looking for so called bargains

Gary