Pros and Cons of the ER collet system

OH MY !!!, I made a mistake and the video is NOT by Guhring. but to get back to the jist of the debate, the lad does say what I already said, the ER is NOT at it's best with Radial loads. because it was originally designed for Axial loads. The high performance chuck is I think similar to the ones made by Schunk. and also Albrecht. There is another video about the HPC which I will try to locate to get the title. it also touches on the Schunk shrink fit and the Albrecht hydraulic

cheers.

I know that this discussion is mainly about the ER collet system, and its uses. There seem to be its detractors here.

With a suitable lathe, if ER collets don't appeal, then the Burnerd Multisize system is a good alternative (says he who uses both systems, with the Multisize collets used solely for workholding).

Read what tony Griffiths has to say about them (bottom of page): http://www.lathes.co.uk/clausing/page5.html

Dave
The Emerald Isle

John, It was you that mentioned a production setting and ER's are simply not suited to that., By the time you screw the closer home then unscrew the closer, any of the" C " range and others are far quicker. They can all be closed by a lever or Hydraulic in a fraction of the time. and time is money. So to get back to my original thoughts, I stick by what I said ER's are designed to take Axial loads from Drill / Reamers it is only secondary that they are used for end mills and thirdly, for workholding [ of which there is a lot of in hobby settings ] I'm always open to learning and you show me ER''s workholding in a production setting and I will eat me humble pie.

cheers.

John, are you saying that Guhring is not a respected source ? They most certainly were NOT designed for milling. as Rego Fix will no doubt confirm . Since they invented the system are they a respected source ?

.

Don't rub it in, Dave

I had a Multisize set, which I had kept for 20+ years [waiting for the day when I might have space for a suitable lathe] ... I started a thread on here, asking for suggestions on a "small footprint" lathe with D1-3 nose fitting.

The advice from 'the wise' here, was that I should sell the Multisze ... Nobody metioned the 'Loughborough' training lathe, which might have done nicely.

I sold the set, and have regretted it ever-since.

This ^^^ is of no real relevance to the current thread, it's just my way of agreeing with your recommendation.

MichaelG.

.

For your amusement: This was the killer-blow ...

I ended a post with: 

. and got the response:

Surely a bit like finding a crutch in the gutter and breaking your leg so as to make full use of it 

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 05/09/2016 15:08:46

Here's a quote:

The REGO-FIX standard ER collet is the most widely used clamping system in the world. Originally created and patented in 1973 by REGO-FIX, it is ideal for a variety of machining applications including boring, milling, reaming, tapping and grinding.

Anyone care to guess where it came from? The US Rego-Fix website.

Andrew

+1 for the Burnerd Multisize collets, I use it more than any other chuck on my lathe.

Dave, I'm certainly not a ER detractor as I have stated many times and not just in this thread I use them a lot, and I like them. This debate is about what they were primarily designed for, which most certainly was not Milling and even less workholding. In our domestic setting they are a boost, but in an industrial setting there are better Endmill holders and better workholding collets. That is all I said. some folks think I mean they are not good for milling iv'e never said that. Of course they are good for milling but not the best, which is what I am saying. And we hobbyists use them for workholding which again is not their strongest point ,there are better types.

cheers

Me too. They have the advantage of being a proper collet chuck with a good range of adjustment. It's often possible to rechuck work without having to recentre it (eg in a 4-jaw), at least for the quality of work I manage!

Andrew, Just because it is the most widely used does not make it the best. Budweiser beer is I think the worlds best selling beer, but its far from the best.. I have e-mailed Rego Fix and await their reply. People have a knack of turning things around here.. I repeat, I never said they are no good at anything, only that they were not designed from the off for milling [ even though they are used a lot for that ] there are better, thats what i'm saying, and they most certainly were not designed for workholding. even though we [hobbyists] use them a lot. None of this can be refuted "they are not the BEST for endmills and not the BEST for workholding I have never intimated that they are no good at all.

I wish some folks would stop twisting things around.

cheers.

Now Muzzer, that IS a true WORKHOLDING Collet system. designed from the off for that purpose. Nothing else.

Edited By Raymond Anderson on 05/09/2016 15:29:39

Here's an ER collet holder coming in at over 8 grand - plus vat. Clearly not for home use!

John, Show me the companies that use then for Workholding and you won't need to concede the point. Now, I'm going to ask this in simple terms, Are they in you're opinion the best for holding endmills, and are they in you're opinion the best for workholding. yes or no is all it needs. because that is what this debate is about. I simply stated that they are not the BEST, not that they are no good. The way they are the best selling chuck for milling is in many ways down to the fact that a smaller inventory is needed to cater for a variety of cutter Ø's certainly not because it is the best [strongest ] system. This thread has gone from me simply stating that they are at their best in an Axial load scenario,and that there are better collet systems for workholding. Iv'e answered the questions iv'e been asked

You can't beat a good debate without insults being hurled about.

Edited By John Stevenson on 05/09/2016 16:42:09

John, I take it you are referring to the "c " system collets for worholding They can grip shorter lengths where an ER needs around 60 % of the part inserted I just think it's a pain having to machine a plug every time you want to grip a short part.. Thats where the " c " and other systems have a definite edge. Agreed, they have less gripping area than the parallel collapsing ER. The "c " system also has the added bonus of being available in round / square / hex and blanks. And I think it was you who mentioned production certainly not me, but since it was mentioned thats another area where true workholding collets out perform the ER's. even though thats not relevant to the hobbyists like me. I do like them in my environment. but i'm going to invest in a Crawford system or maybe a Bison that uses the larger "c " size

cheers.

Being a Scot cost certainly touches a raw nerve with me also, i'm not immune At the end of the day John You, I and everybody else, uses the best they can afford. There is one thing I won't do and that is skimp on tools. Yes, i'm very fortunate in that I get a very good discount through the brothers employers. Thats why i'm going to up grade me collet system but still keep me ER's. when all said and done I like having a friendly debate / difference of views. And I really do LIKE me ER's.

cheers.