Member postings for Bruce Voelkerding

I have not built any internal combustion engines, but I would think making the Cylinder as a Sleeve or a Flanged Sleeve would make the casting of the Main Body much easier. If the Flange were on the Head side it could be sandwiched between the Head and Body with the Head Bolts. Leakage at the opposite end could be dealt with some sort of Sealant.

This removes the interrupted cut as you try to machine the Cylinder Feature as shown. You will need to add clearance for the Crank Shaft at bottom dead center.

one other tidbit - I live in the US. Every time I have ordered Model Engineer (by phone to the UK) using my MasterCard, a "Hold" was placed on the Card as the purchase was a possible fraud or theft. I always call my Master Card company after the transaction to explain it was an intentional purchase.

I have also had this happen once using my Card at a convenience store 60 miles from my home.

When I travel to Europe I always call the company first and give them the dates I will be out of the country.

Derek,

don't be surprised after you split the Horn Block castings that the "open end" doesn't fit well. It has happened on all 20 Horn Blocks that I have machined (these were all 3-1/2" gauge cast Bronze and single piece - it sounds like you have the kind cast as a pair). Even though I made a special jig to hold them and there was no taper on the sides as they came off the Mill, they distorted by the time I got around to riveting them onto the Frames.

No need to worry - I used a Screw and a Nut as an internal Jack and held them tight in the Frame Slots as I drilled & riveted them. I machined the working faces holding the Frames as a pair outside Face to outside Face, Frames sitting vertical in the Mill Vice, using an End Mill.

I remember Don Young mentioned something about the Derby 4F & 2P valve gear, but was not sure what it was. I had subscribed to his magazine LLAS for a year or two. This morning I came across LLAS magazine #26, dated Feb 86, mixed in with my ME back issues. In this issue Don was describing the building of the 2P. Here are some extracts -

"Just one point to be mentioned for those who have purchased drawings ahead of Sheet No. 3 appearing in LLAS, in that the slideshaft has been moved from the center line of the slides to the top of them. I put the slideshaft on the center line originally because this was the approximate position full size on all engines fitted with Joy valve gear, plus this helped mask the presence of said Joy valve gear in lieu of the authentic Stephenson gear with rockers, but it meant in practice that the .16 inch dimension of metal to be removed between the slides had to be exceded to achieve working clearance for the vibrating links, and although the end result was perfectly satisfactory, moving the slideshaft upwards to what I would call the "LBSC position" means the drawing dimension can be adhered to, thus saving me a query or two."

Note in the text above "slideshaft" refers only to the .38 x .38 x 2.75 bar which is a component of the "slideshaft assembly". The fulcrum pin location was not altered.

In the same issue referring to the Slide Valve -

"Incidentally, when my 4F pencil drawing was traced back in 1974, a poor 6 became a 0, so what should have read .561 inch became .501 inch, something that was perpetuated initially on the 2P. It was in fact a 2P builder who advised me of my error, I guess that by the number of 4F's already running at the time it was a rather obvious mistake, so I simply corrected the drawings and forgot about it. Unknown to me, however, the designer of the Clayton Steam Waggon that has become very popular through a series in "Model Engineer", used those 4F cylinders and repeated my dimensional error."

I hope I didn't make any transcription errors.

Moderator - could you add these comments in the drawing errors section ?

Bruce

Hallo Manda,

just saw your Post. I live 5 miles west of Cleveland Hopkins Airport (northeast Ohio) - I was outside clearing my driveway of 8 inches of snow from last night.

I was just old enough to see the last of the Nickel Plate Berkshires work. My Dad would take us to the Nickel Plate and the old B&O to watch the trains.

Bruce

I was an engineer at Warner & Swasey, Cleveland, Ohio, in the 1980's as the change was made from oil-lubricated taper roller bearing Headstocks with selectable gear trains to grease lubricated Ball Bearings. This change came about due to the vastly improved Spindle drive motors coming onto the market. Many of the Lathes (8" to 12" Chuck) were sold with no Gearbox. Larger Lathes (16" to 24" Chuck) were sometimes fitted with a separate 2-speed Gearbox.

The Ball Bearings were typically sourced from FAG. We had a "clean room" in which the bearings would be packed with a German grease, Kluber if I remember correctly. The grease was weighed out for each bearing. It was stuffed in a large plastic syringe which had been previously weighed so the grease could be ejected till the final net weight was obtained. This remaining amount would be injected around the bearing. Typically we had 3 Ball Bearings and the head end and 2 at the tail end - all angular contact (15 to 20 degree).

One of the most important steps of the process was the running in of the Spindle. I seem to remember this run-in lasted 4 hours. Since these were all CNC machines, it was a matter of loading the run-in program, attaching a couple of thermocouples and hitting a button. The thermocouples were used "just in case" as the machine was run-in without supervision. The Spindle would run at 50 rpm for 15 minutes to start, then bump up to 100 rpm for a minute, back to 50 for 10 minutes, then up to 200 for a minute, back to 50, and so on. At the end the Spindle could run all day at its max design speed. We had a range of Spindle designs from 1,800 rpm to 4,500 rpm.

I remember one machine where the run-in was missed. As the machine was being prepared to do a customer's demonstration part, the Spindle locked-up and kicked out the Drive Motor. It was determined the run-in had been missed. The grease had not been "channeled around the Bearings". The ensuing churning of the grease generated enough heat to cause the Spindle to expand and lock the bearings. The Spindle was allowed a day to cool naturally, the run-in procedure was done, and no measurable problems could be detected in the bearings. That was a relief as those bearings cost in the neighborhood of $1,000 back then.

The long and short of it is - pack the bearing around half full, allow the grease to "channel" by running the lathe at a low speed for say 15 minutes.

I was given a Boring Head with a set of Boring Tools from a local Machine Shop. It was given to me because " I don't know what's wrong, it chatters". I traced the chatter down to the R8 Shank was undersize. I replaced the R8 Shank and it works very well.

The set of Boring Bars I received look like the picture in the Arc-Euro ad - the shanks are plain diameters with no flats. At first I thought to put flats on the Boring Bar shanks so the set screws would not cause dings in the shanks which would make it horrible to remove the m from the Head. Then I realized there was no way to put the Boring Bar in the Head and assure the cutting surface was parallel with the Head motion (as mentioned by John Haine above). I did put flats on the shanks, but the solution was to measure the shank diameter of the Boring Bars. I then put each Boring Bar in the Mill Vice horizontal and rotated the Boring Bar axially until the cutting face of the Carbide was exactly 1/2 the diameter of the shank diameter below the top of the shank (easy to do with a Dial Indicator). I then milled a flat along the shank to a width equal to the set screw size. I can now place a Boring Bar in the Boring Head and slightly jiggle it as I tighten the set screws and it is always aligned correctly. Plus the dings do not prevent the Boring Bar from sliding out freely.

Of course the Boring Head in a Mill is only as good as the clearance in the Quill (unless you lock the Quill and feed using the Knee).

Another one of those "I did it quicker than the time it took to write this project".

Bruce, Cleveland, Ohio

some very good YouTube videos on model locomotive building by MrCrispin96. Search

Home Workshop Engineering - Assembling the Chassis Part 1

Garry,

a process step I would have done first would have been to turn & face the end of the stock which is held in the chuck jaws. This gives one a better surface to grip on (no worries about stock taper or ovality). Plus the finished back surface is there in case you need it for a measurement or setting/clamping in a mill vice before the part is parted off. But, great progress ! It's great to see your posts.

Bruce

Garry - 3 comments:

1. if I were machining the side of the Steam Chest as your picture shows, I would do it the same with parallels locating the inside surface BUT I would use shorter parallels to allow a better grip in the vice. Check your high-speed tool blanks, they are quite parallel but often one side is different thickness than the other. Mark with felt tip pen.

2. if I were holding the Steam Chest in the 4-Jaw Chuck to machine the Valve Rod Gland as your picture shows, I would do it the same BUT I would use say 1/4" x 3/4" pieces of steel across the Steam Chest on the two Jaws which are "gripping air". To keep them from dropping out when adjusting the 4-Jaw, I would have used double sided Scotch tape between the Valve Chest and the steel pieces. I had a very similar set-up as yours shift on me once.

3. when machining an INSIDE rectangle like the start of your Valve Chest machining, I first get a clean sheet of paper and make a very simple sketch of the part as it sits in the Mill. I place it on my workbench next to the Mill. Note I do not have digital readouts on my Mill, I use the hand wheel graduations. I enter the Endmill into the Steam Chest and make a cut all around the interior profile. A light cut - just enough to see how the casting is aligned. The IMPORTANT part - as I do this cut I write down the Hand Wheel numbers. As an example, with a RH Endmill you will cut the side closest to you going from right to left. On my sketch I first would write CW at the bottom of my sketch with the value of the in-out handwheel. The I turn the right-left Handwheel CCW to cut to towards the left side of the Steam Chest. When I stop the cut, on the LH side of the sketch I write CCW .086 (or whatever the number on the Hand Wheel is). I do this all around the part for all the faces.

Now I can measure how much needs to come off and determine how many passes are required. I write these numbers under the numbers on my sketch and go at it. Notice I do NOT use any stops. I write the CW and CCW down as I once used a machine with a "backwards" thread and I have been ruined for life. By having the CW & CCCW I do not get confused. I just run around the inside of the part keeping an eye on my sketch. Once you understand the system it becomes second nature and takes less time than fiddling with the Stops. You can stop at any time and measure th part and make fine adjustments by tweaking the numbers on the sketch.

Bruce

I have a question, when silver soldering the end caps. does one apply flux to the surfaces and then push them together, or does one just apply flux at the joint after assembling the parts ? What about the washer by the chimney ? Would one apply flux on top of the cap and under the washer, or not ?

I have silver soldered various pipe fittings, but never a boiler.

Pete,

I hope you realize the Axle Boxes are not in the "nominal design" running position on your drawing. Bottom of Frames to Axle center should be 5/8" (I do not see the 1/8" clearance under the Axle Box). I would imagine there are a lot of Tichs running out there with Axle Boxes hard down in the Horns - but this will make a lot of measurements seen odd later as you progress drawing the Connecting Rod and Valve Gear.

Bruce

Perhaps Cabeng could discuss more re tip geometry. It seems many users are not quite aware of the various top rake angles available with carbide inserts. I designed lathes for 12 years and I know the top rake angle was carefull selected for each customer runoff (to the likes of Caterpillar, John Deere, Ford, New Departure,etc). Most steel and iron jobs were run with negative rake insetrs due to it being a more robust insert. Another concern was the BUE. Another big concern was life of the insert.

I do not have first hand experience as I still use hand-ground HSS tools in my hobbyshop.

Bruce

Ady1, there are quite a few popane fired locomotives here in the States (very clean, low fire risk). I live in Ohio where fires are relatively unheard of, but there a number of propane locomotives. I have never seen an oil fired one around here. But out West I imagine one needs to really think about fuel type due to forest fires.

My son (age 27) is just completing an electric locomotive. Yes, it is to a steam locomotive profile, but it his first effort. I think in that respect it is a great first step into this hobby.

Bruce

a solution to the lost funnel - use the top off a 2-liter cola bottle. One can shape the "bell" to suit the application. I came across this idea once while changing oil in a sailboat - the engine was tucked under the cockpit. And the oil does not wet the surface - every last drop runs out of it.

there is a good YouTube video "6024 King Edward I attains 2000 (Draw bar horse power) on Wilmc".The video is by "psovmainline". It is a split screen with video in the cab and from outside. The question I have is: at 1:38 the Driver has just shut the Regulator and is opening it for maximum drawbar pull. BUT at the same time he does not let up swinging a lever underneath the Reverser Screw. The question is : What is that lever ??

Could it be the sanding lever and it requires stroking to maintain the flow of sand ?

thanks in advance,

Bruce

Gary, I would do the same setup EXCEPT I would not use the bar. Your setup assumes the tops of the vice jaws are parallel to the milling table. Are they ? I would guess the vice's fixed jaw is just as perpendicular to the milling table. I would set the casting at the midpoint of the jaws to minimise any twisting effect of the clamping force out of line with the vice screw. Set the casting as low as you can place it with allowance for the cut. I would put a piece of paper between the moveable jaw and the casting face. I never learned the use of paper in the "real" world, rather I learned it in ME. It does work. Also, watch carefully as you cut. You should notice a better finish cutting one direction versus the other. I would take all the finish cuts in one direction only.

All, I have just had contact with Blackgates and they have acquired the drawings and patterns for the Clarkson's designs. They now have the Stirling 8' Single 4-2-2 drawings available with castings to come. I am ordering my drawings tomorrow !

No one has an answer regarding the question " should the radius of a locomotive type Expansion Link equal the length of the Eccentric Rods" from my email above ? I would appreciate any comments.

Bruce

I am building my Netta with LBSC drawings and castings from Reeves. However, I am making slight detail changes here and there, hopefully to mke it a bit better. I did not care for the cylinder angle shown on LBSC's drawings, I am leaning towards making it 3 degrees.

I discovered the issue with the Wheel counterweighta as I began to face them and I heard a second click in the interrupted cut as I began to face the hub. My solution was the same as John's, I milled the weights to size. I took the opportunity to reduce the counterweight and hub on the leading axle by 1/32" per side.

As a side note, I machined the wheels on the usual "turned in place" stub mandrel with threaded end. Since all the wheel bores were within .0005" (all made at the same time with the same process), I decided to do one operation per wheel per mounting, i.e. I rough turned all the ODs one after the other, I then finish faced the wheels one after the other, etc. It did mean mounting and dis-mounting the wheels many times, but as I have no quick-change tool holder. The oerations were executed very fast as I was not constantly re-adjusting the tool or measuring size. My old SouthBend lathe is very repeatable. All eight wheels were finish turned in ~10 hours tops.

I do not understand the Frame Stretcher problem dimension. It does foul the Eccentric Rods and I assume that is the reason for the large opening in it. On sheet 2, middle of the drawing, it shows a dimension of 1" from the axle centerline to the face of the Stay. It seems like you erected the Stay backwards, although with the Reeves Hornblocks, that would not fit without maching more off the back face.

I am coming to a point where I have two questions:

1. is there an error with the Eccentric Rods ? Their centers are shown as 5 1/8", but they are attached to a loco style Expansion Link which has a 5 1/4" radius. Although I have a couple of books on Valve Gears, none state explicitly that the radii should be identical. I note they are the same for LBSC's Maisie.

2. Crosshead clearance: the locomotive centerline to cylinder centerline is 1 7/16" + 1/8" + 1 1/16" = 2 5/8". Minus half the Crosshead thickness gives 2 5/8 - 7/32 = 2.406". Compare this to the leading Coupled Wheel 1.641 + .500 +.188 + .062 = 2.391" or .015" clearance per side. Since the wheel face to bearing face clearance is 1/64" per side, this would indicate the clearance could drop to zero when rounding curves which would allow the CrankPin or leadoing Coupling Rod clicking the CrossHead. I am addind clearance to my model. Any comments ?

Bruce