Member postings for Chris Crew

I made the Radford graduating tool and the Radford head-stock dividing attachment (later revised by GHT) to go with it. It is very effective and a good exercise in rack and pinion cutting and ball turning. BTW, if you decide to make the head-stock attachment use the GHT calculations for the worm as there is a small error in Radford's specifications. No castings are required for either device.

Gerry, I have just thought that it might be worth calling the company that took over the J&S name and asking if they still provide a gasket kit for your machine although it would be easy enough to make your own, I suppose. I remember buying a gasket kit from the real J&S at Narborough Road in Leicester and it was surprisingly cheap for a J&S product. They may just still be available given the number of these machines that abound. Other than that Jubilee machine tools (Pope's) in Derby may be able to help as they specialise in refurbishing these machines, or at least they used to. You could get a new wheel-head drive belt from there too.

I believe the early machines had a Morse taper drive in the horizontal spindle whilst the later machines have a 30INT drive. If you must have a Senior I would try to find a later machine with an improved spindle, buts that's only my personal preference.

Gerry, Judging by the electrical gear on the front panel your machine looks like mine, circa 1971. When I acquired it, getting on for twenty years ago now, it was in about the same state as yours too. The table would not oscillate and no amount of penetrating oil, as recommended by the real J&S in Leicester because I called their technical support department at the time, would free it. The only thing to do was to strip it down completely and excavate the shuttle valve, thoroughly cleaning everything as I went. I actually had no idea what I was going to find and I think, if my memory serves me correctly, it looked pretty complicated with all the hydraulics etc. BTW, the table is held down by gravity alone. Once you have disconnected the push/pull rods it will simply lift off but it is very heavy and I advise a two man lift if you intend to do this. I did manage everything on my own but I was twenty years younger and fitter in those days and it was still a struggle. When I got the shuttle valve out I found it was absolutely seized solid. There must have been some water in the hydraulic oil and with the machine standing unused, for I don't know how long, the oil had congealed and corrosion set in. To free the piston I had to hold the valve in the vice, put a brass rod against and smack it hard with a hammer several times and it eventually shifted. I was expecting to have to replace the valve but the piston and cylinder didn't look too bad when cleaned and lubricated so I decided to replace it into the machine when I re-assembled everything. It has worked perfectly well for twenty years although I think the machine has had an hydraulic oil change since and I keep running it for a few minutes occasionally to make sure the oil is circulated as it doesn't get used in anger all that often. I don't know the level of your skill but don't be put off by what you find under the table. Maybe ignorance is bliss in my case but I tend not to be afraid of taking things apart and simply reversing the process after having a 'look-see' and cleaning everything.

Edited By Chris Crew on 06/12/2021 21:19:37

Gerry, It's definitely a roll pin on mine. It is not a taper pin on, at least, my machine as suggested by Dave S although that is not to say all machines will be identical. I have just been out to the workshop and tapped it halfway out and back in again just to prove it for you.

It is supposed to be, and in actual fact is, a public duty and a valuable service one should, if possible, provide. In my view, the summoning to serve on a jury and participate in our justice system should be accepted with alacrity and every effort made to fulfil this moral obligation.

Having been caught out this year by the cancellation of the Midlands Model Engineering exhibition that was trailed and publicised as definitely going ahead, I will not be making any arrangements to visit any exhibition until it actually opens. Although I understand the circumstances that have obtained this year, raising an expectation that an event was definitely to be staged, when there may have been reasonable grounds for doubt, and then withdrawing it at relatively short notice was most unfair in my opinion.

Tim, Whilst accepting that this is not a forum for historical debate, and we can argue the semantics of the word, I would contend that America had, or even still has an empire, or at least imperial ambition. Looking at, for example, its conquest of the nations on the same continent from which it acquired what became the south western states and Pacific wars of the 19th and early 20th centuries in which it acquired such as the Philippines and Hawaii etc.. I am not sure if it imposed its industrial thread standards on these territories, I suppose it must have done in Texas, New Mexico and California etc., but you did at least ask someone to explain and I can recommend further reading on the subject if anyone so wishes, but I doubt that they will, LOL!

Edited By Chris Crew on 30/11/2021 11:41:57

Edited By Chris Crew on 30/11/2021 11:48:55

It seems I have wasted my time in building the Radford Thread Milling Attachment, making the patterns and getting them cast because they are not commercially available and spending time figuring out how to overcome the 'chicken and egg' situation of the need to hob a worm-wheel without the hob which needs the attachment to make it. It would have been far easier just to make rotary cutter with a 29 degree angle. I wish I had seen this video earlier - why can't I think of these things? Doh!

A few years ago I was invited by a woman, with whom I had no connection, to view her late father's workshop in case there were any items that I may be interested in. There were a couple of things and I offered what I considered to be a very fair price for the items which she declined, I then increased my offer which she also declined. I then enquired as to the price she actually wanted for the items but she refused to name a price at which point I politely explained that it was obvious that we could not do business and left the premises. I was not out to take advantage of this person but she obviously thought I was, hence my leaving.

I would suppose that when relatives, who know nothing of model engineering, but have witnessed a lifetime of the deceased cherishing and treasuring of their tools and equipment become convinced that it must be worth some kind of fortune and are very suspicious of anyone offering a fair 'market price' when disposal becomes necessary. So, there are three options: either sell it yourself and try to get the price you personally suppose it is worth, hand it all over to an auction house who will charge you transport fees, commission and VAT on their services etc. or auction it yourself online. At least in an auction you will get the maximum price that any one buyer in the audience would be willing to pay and the price will depend on the size of that audience and the demand for any particular item at that particular time. Whichever route you choose to go down I have a feeling that the results will not be entirely to your satisfaction but that is life, sadly.

John, it sounds and looks like you have acquired a fine machine from a previous owner who obviously knew what he was doing. But, and I know I am being a bit pedantic here, it is not a 'cog' it is known as a 'bull-wheel' or back-gear. I am sure the lathe will give you many years of good and accurate service. And remember, we never make mistakes, we only learn lessons and I have a very large scrap-box to prove it! Good Luck and keep us posted as to how you get on.

Might I just add that, if the previous owned has not already done it, it is worthwhile coding the available divisions on the face of the bull-wheel with coloured dots with enamel paint or coloured permanent marker pen. This saves counting the teeth when using the bull-wheel as an index.

I can't remember off the top of my head the colours I have used, they were listed on a note-pad in the workshop, but it goes something like this: blue dot at tooth 1 and 30 for two divisions, red dot at tooth 1, 20 & 40 for three divisions all the way round to maybe a yellow dot at tooth 1,3,6, 9,12,15,18,21,24,27,30,33,36,39,42,45,48,51,54,57,(60 or 1 again) for twenty divisions, I am sure you get the idea and its actually the tooth spaces that are marked, not the teeth themselves as, obviously, the plunger engages in the spaces.

Edited By Chris Crew on 28/11/2021 22:09:22

The plunger that engages with the bull-wheel is not a Myford component or accessory, it is a dividing attachment that someone has made and fitted. Because the S7 has a 60 tooth bull-wheel it can be used to index 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 10, 12, 15, 20, 30 and 60 divisions. This would be used with, say, a tool-post mounted drilling spindle or graduating attachment. You will find it very useful once you become more experienced with your lathe.

The two pointed screws on the counter-shaft are again not a standard Myford fitting. They have been fitted by someone to hold the Radford or George Thomas head-stock dividing attachment as is the small bracket above the gear-box. These additional components are identical to those on my own lathe which I fitted myself. The Radford/Thomas dividing attachment allow you to index the spindle through any number of divisions or degrees of arc and is very worthwhile accessory to make and use. I use mine mostly in conjunction with the Radford graduating attachment but is can be used for many operations that require accurate divisions.

You could do no better than to acquire a copy of George Thomas' Workshop Manual which will explain all this to you. It is not rocket science so don't be discouraged, if I can do it a mentally retarded chimpanzee can do it! Originally, I think, George Thomas published three books: one the Workshop Manual, one on Dividing and Graduating and another on building his Universal Pillar Tool. I believe that later all three books were condensed into a single expanded workshop manual, so check before you buy a used copy as to which edition you are getting. I think that the Manual is available from TEE Publishing and it is worth every single penny to the amateur craftsman, IMO.

Edited By Chris Crew on 28/11/2021 21:44:35

Martin,

Fitting bearings has always been a bit hit and miss for me, in fact I have that very job coming up again shortly for the Radford Thread Milling attachment which requires four ball races and a thrust bearing fitting for the worm-shaft. I may have been lucky on a couple of previous occasions when I have measured the diameter of the bore of the bearing recess using a telescopic gauge and micrometer. I made the recess the same diameter as the bearing outer ring, leaving it on the small side, and pressed the bearing in using the vice although I was very careful and conscious that I may crack the casting, so I needed to feel the bearing seating properly without too much pressure but with sufficient resistance to prevent it rotating in the recess. I have used the same 'feel' for the fit of the bearings on a shaft but I admit it is a little 'hit and miss' and is where the cylindrical grinder comes in for sizing the shafts a little more accurately than in the lathe. I am not a trained metal-worker, although I did receive some professional training on lathe work during a later abandoned apprenticeship in the 1960's, so I have to do the best I can which I suspect is the case for the majority of amateur back-shed workers. Of course, I will only get one chance to fit the four bearings as I cannot obtain another casting, so if it goes a bit pear-shaped I will have to resort to the Loctite. Fingers crossed!

Edited By Chris Crew on 21/11/2021 22:55:44

" I wonder how many amateurs really get consistent high accuracy results by measuring? It's not how I work: I measure to get 'close enough', 0.02mm, and then fit as necessary. Fitting is done by using one part as a gauge and comparing: I don't know or care what the exact size is. I'm not making jigs, gauges or turbine blades!

Does anyone really work to tenths, and if so what for? How is that level of accuracy achieved across an assembly? Have the measurements been confirmed by someone else?"

I wholeheartedly agree with these statements from Dave. It is exactly how I work, although for me it's usually in imperial units. I have read posts that appear indicate to that some contributors work to NPL standards and whilst some people may be capable of achieving this level of precision, or think they are achieving this high standard, I doubt if many actually do in a home workshop. That is not to criticise their work which is probably superb and far above anything I could possibly achieve myself, but it does somewhat call into question the 'holier than thou' attitude as regards accuracy and precision.

I have a 50 year old J&S 540 calibrated to 0.0001" and a 60 year old J&S 1310 calibrated to 0.0002" and whilst I set myself little exercises in working to these theoretical limits, given the wear in the machines, I doubt if anything I turn out is better than 0.001", if that. And in any event I only have 'workshop grade' micrometers and calipers to check the dimensions so I also have to resort to a bit of traditional 'fitting'. My workshop philosophy has always been if it looks right, fits right and works right, then it is right!

If the lathe is that good you might consider buying it anyway because, in my opinion, PCF on a lathe the size of a Myford is a luxury that is nice to have but would hardly ever be used. If you have so many photos of the machine you should be able to see if it has PCF by simply looking at the apron or for the keyway in the lead-screw.

For gauge plate, key and silver steel try Coventry Grinders. They also supply all manner of grinding wheels too.

Personally, I am ambivalent about PCF, I have it on my Colchester and have hardly use it over the years but don't have it on my ML7-R and never missed it or wanted it when when I enhanced the machine to almost a S7 spec. less gearbox. Concerning changing to a different machine, again I would have mixed feelings. Whilst at my age I will never be changing my lathes now, and someone will get some nice machines when it is time to sell, if I were younger I would be seriously considering moving to a new far eastern machine. I know that there are some superb examples of Myford machines on the used market from owners that have cherished them, but I can't think that this would be quite the same case with the larger old British lathes because as these obsolete machines pass from owner to owner over the years they must surely wear and deteriorate however well they are cared for and sourcing spares becomes either prohibitively expensive or impossible.

Mark, My advice to you would be to make a simple grinding jig to grind the requisite tool to cut your thread, both inside and out. Even on a cheap bench grinder it really isn't that difficult with an enlarged rest and a little care, even down to about 3/8" internal.

I always cut internal threads on the rear face of the bore with the tool inverted because you can see what is happening to a certain extent and you withdraw the cross-slide at the end of the cut as if cutting an external thread but this is not so important with a left-hander as the tool will be moving outwards anyway.

Go slow, the tool only removes the same amount of material if you are going at 1 RPM or 1000 RPM so the slower the better in my book. Also, cut the external thread first to use as a gauge for the internal. You may find that you may have relieve the flanks of the internal thread a little by advancing the top-slide a couple of thou. to get a nice fit.

I can send you a picture but not sure how to do it here. if you PM me with an email address I will forward it to you, but I would suggest its really not necessary because it's just a screw with a flat head about 0.5" dia. straight knurled on the edge if the one on my machine is original. If you know the thread you could make something to fit in about 5 minutes max.