Member postings for Graham Williams 12

GordonH, sorry just reread your post.

Thanks JasonB, I looked at Blackgates and had missed there listing of 5" i.d x 10swg...thanks.

Further reading of Jack Buckler's Sweet Pea book, looking at smoke box details and the spacer ring dimensions work out to a 5 3/16" (5.1875" which would slide over a 5.16" o.d boiler tube. Therefore boiler drawing must be as intended so can only assume a 5" I.D x 14swg tube was available in the past.

I've just seen a Metremaid (0-6-0 version of SweetPea) boiler being constructed on YouTube and I'm now pretty sure that 5" I.D x 10swg is now being used for both Firebox inner and Boiler Tube.

Thanks

Graham

Gordon, thanks for reply. I do not have a problem sourcing 5” OUTSIDE diameter tubes. What surprised me is that the boiler design for the Sweet Pea in Jack Buckler’s book specifies 5” INSIDE diameter. (Boiler drawing on p.102). To my knowledge all copper tubes are specified by there outside diameters.

I was hoping someone who has built the Sweet Pea could throw some light on wether this is a drawing error and should have been dimensioned to the outside of the tube.

Thanks very much for the M metal suppliers, they will be very useful I’m sure, and they do list a 5 1/4” o.d x 10 S.W.G tube which would be close to a 5”” nominal I.D tube.

but a 5” I.d x 14 swg (0.080&rdquo would be a pretty weird size of 5.16” nominal outside diameter. This is what is drawn in Jack Buckler’s book.

I was considering making a Sweet Pea. Any other part I wouldn’t worry about it but due to the problem of deviating from an established / published boiler design I wanted to clarify this.

So is it a drawing mistake? Any help appreciated.

Graham

I'm in the process of looking into the viability of building Kozo's "Pennsy" in 1 1/16" scale as my first loco. I have his book and he covers this loco in 3/4" and 1.5" scale for 3.5" and 7.5 (7.25" gauge respectively. He considers this to be an ideal first locomotive.

I have come to the idea that a 5" gauge locomotive is a more suitable scale for me, the 3/4" a little small and the 1.5" is a little too large.

I have started drawing up a boiler based around a 5" tube (both sizes of Kozo's Pennsy's have a rolled tube with a butt & strap joint at the bottom).

I looked at the Sweet Pea boiler design for a comparison and it uses a 5" I.D tube - 5" I.D x 14 S.W.G for boiler and 5" x 10 S.W.G for the firebox tube.

The commonly available tubes are 5" OUTSIDE diameter. I have watched videos with Sweet Pea boilers being constructed and they are definitely extruded tubes.

If a 5.25" tube is available this would be more suitable for many reasons.

If anyone can shed any light on this and any comments about the change of scale it would be appreciated.

Graham

Barry

I haven’t been in the employ of the company where I used the XYZ,s and no longer have access to them or the manuals. Pity or the would be quite a few “homer’s” going through the work shop. I think you must be referring to the small sequence that you can run every now and again to dial out the backlash in the lead screws. Obviously no clamps so just relying on holding torque of servos and minimal backlash.

Graham

Hi Barry, very interesting. That’s a good solution which I will keep in mind. Thanks

Graham

Welcome Barry, that’s great having a dealer like that near you. I used to use a XYZ with Prototrak (2 and 3 axis) at work - great machines which I sorely miss. Really wanted to get one for my home workshop but in the end it was the added cost of having 3 phase installed that was the deal breaker for me.

have fun

Graham

The last revisions on my set of drawings were 1978 giving some idea as to their age, so may have been a few changes I don’t know about. Any help would be appreciated.

Graham

Dave, agree with everything you have said there.

Jason, that’s good to know. So far I have been very impressed with the drawing’s.

Graham

Thanks for suggestion Nick.

I’m Oxfordshire (near Chipping Norton) so too far!

thanks for that Baz, and very good point about being cheaper, specially with price of copper!
Have you or anyone else experience of rolling copper at this thickness (3/32&rdquo?

I’ve looked at making a set of “George Thomas” type rolls, but not sure wether his original design would be up to this thick walled tube even allowing for annealing. Most commercial Hobbiest type rolls I’ve seen are for round about 1mm thick sheet.

push comes to shove I’ll try one of the local sheet metal companies to roll it for me (have also asked Blackgates for a price….just like to do as much as possible of the work myself for the satisfaction of doing it
Graham

Hi Jon

I have just started this engine - great to see someone else already building the 2” Burrell. How’s the progress?

and bricky/Frank who has completed an engine.
My drawings are old (not sure how old?) so I hope you don’t mind if from time to time I ask if something may have been changed on later drawings? give each other some help…

Graham

Thanks Jason

Macc doesn’t stock this size but will contact Blackgate.

seems to be a bit of odd size on this engine 3 3/4” O.D x 13 swg copper, if Blackgates don’t stock it looks like it will be rolled tube with butt strap…

Graham

A little mystery: with the plan set I bought was two folders. All the parts had been hand drafted on A4 lined paper at a smaller scale - a tremendous amount of work! The chap I brought them from - Ben who is very much involved with full size steam engines - bought them from someone about 15 years ago - and didn’t know why this had been done.

As an old time draughtsman and more latterly design engineer (retired) I appreciate just how much work was involved in this.

I can only think this may have been the old version of what I am doing right now - modelling it in 3D CAD to “get the parts into your head”, or that it was just to have workshop sized drawings rather than having the A0 drawings laying around.
or is there another explanation?

Any thoughts or is this jogging someone’s memory?

Graham

Hi all.

I first joined this forum back in 2019 when I was seeking advice on machine tools for my shop for a certain project.

I am now in a position to do what of always wanted to do - build a live steam engine.

A 2” Burrell Gold Medal Tractor (produced by MJ Engineering) came up on flea bay which seemed an ideal project (most of castings and plans set).

I am just in process of familiarising myself with what’s in there and what’s not.

I contacted Alan at MJ Engineering with a view to purchasing a boiler kit but was sad to learn he has stopped supplying boiler kits because of complication with CE marking etc. and his recommendation was to buy a commercial boiler from Western Steam.
However, making the boiler is something I really want to do so I have started researching and compiling the information to do this and already have some questions for this forum which I will post shortly. I have already read on this and other forums enough to realise that boiler building and more particularly certifications are a bit of a minefield , but that adds to the challenge doesn’t it?

I am aware I will need the input from my local club boiler inspector, and emailed my local(ish) club at Banbury on Monday but as yet have had no reply. Are they still active?

Graham

Thanks for all the advice and the supplier links. I started to look at the difference between ISO 68 hydraulic oil and ISO 68 gear oil. I must admit I have been thinking ISO 68 is a hydraulic oil. I gather it is more of a viscosity grading system. I ended up on a lubricant manufacturer’s website. A young lady adviser asked if I needed help. I asked her wether it was okay to use hydraulic oil in a lathe gearbox. She stated hydraulic...oil is for hydraulic’s and gear oil is for gearboxes!

Armed with this new knowledge I had a rethink!

As far as I can tell the ISO 32 I already bought will be okay for the auto oiler on the Gate mill, so will use that for that purpose and possibly the lathe headstock. I bought 20 litres of ISO 68 locally this morning which I will use for the lathe gearboxes and will have plenty to flush the sludge from the gearboxes first (there was plenty of sludge in the apron gearbox).

Thanks for the links to suppliers of smaller quantities but needed to buy locally as holding up the lathe rebuild.

I was encouraged to see your industrial machine specified ISO 68 hydraulic oil Andrew. In the Grizzly Lathe manual it just says ISO 68 oil so I am not sure wether they are referring to hydraulic oil?

Thanks again to all who took the time to reply, great help as always.

Graham

Thanks guys, I will confidently use the ISO 32 oil I bought today. Thanks Bazyle for a whole new perspective on lubrication, and sorry for asking the same old question. You obviously know abit about it, for someone who doesn’t the hard thing is knowing what is important and what’s not - such as the lead screw as you say. Easy to get too hung up on it though 😊

Graham Williams 11, thanks for the supplier recommend. Does that mean there are 12 of us Graham Williams’s on this forum?

Thanks Graham

Hi all

I need some help deciding which oil to use in my Warco GH1330 which I was hoping to buy locally.

After some quick research I came to the conclusion I needed ISO 32 hydraulic oil for the gearbox(es)? and ISO 68 for the apron.

It is mainly the apron I am concerned with right now as I have it stripped down for a rebuild. I could only buy ISO 68 in a 25l drum which was too expensive. I bought 5l of ISO 32.

Whilst trying to decide wether I could use the ISO 32 in the apron I chanced upon the nearest equivalent manual - the Grizzly G9036 (1340). I was surprised that this manual recommends ISO 68 for Headstock, Gearbox and Apron.

I know ISO 32 is quite a thin runny oil and ISO 68 is more like treacle. Is it because America has a warmer climate perhaps?

Or should I wait until Friday and buy some at the ME exhibition Warwick?

Your thoughts please

Graham

Edited By Graham Williams 12 on 14/10/2019 19:43:51

Hi Brian

pm sent

Graham

Hi Brian,

yes, I can see the attraction in that... and 856 yards is a loooong way. Certainly get plenty of exercise doing that as well! Interesting that the crossbow distance is less! Congratulations on your titles.

i shot compound in the Oxfordshire team and for two local clubs. In a lot of the competitions I entered at that time (it’s going back a few years now) I came second most of the time, as I shot in the same club as the British compound champion at that time!

Any projects in the pipeline apart from the archery?

Graham

Brian, out of interest what bows do you make? I have an interest as I used to shoot compound bow competitively

Graham