Member postings for Bill Phinn

Thanks for the clarification, Jason.

Ron, the advantage, as I see it, with the electronic one is that the instant a light comes on is less open to interpretation than the instant a shaft starts to slide sideways. This assumes the light works by being either on or off and doesn't, for example, start very dim and come on with increasing intensity the more firmly it contacts the edge. The only real disadvantage I can see is the need for extra care to avoid overrun in case you damage the tip.

Thanks, Jason. Good to know they can be used with the mill running. Also good to see from your photo how with a bit of thought you can still use them on non-conductive material.

What is the overshoot leeway on one of these? I notice some of the ball-ended types have up to 2mm. Presumably it's somewhat less on the PEC type we're discussing.

Any chance of providing a link to your item?

I'm getting on OK with mechanical edge finders, but I do like the idea of the convenience of an electronic one. Since these are used without rotating the spindle, presumably your spindle/chuck/collet has to be very concentric for the finder to give completely dependable results. I notice the kind of 3D tester Andrew uses has adjustment screws to compensate for any run-out.

One last point: do I take it the z-axis edge finding function on these two different kinds of tester is for checking the flatness of a part rather than establishing a starting point for milling etc? I can't really see how it can be the latter unless the difference in z height between your cutting tool tip and the finder tip is somewhow readily calculable.

Take care, Raphael, and thanks!

Thanks a lot for the further replies.

Ron, I'd have to alter the radius of my collet nut C spanner as well as its pin to make it suitable for the spindle hole. I'd then be unable to use it on the collet nut.

I'm going to follow up Jason's suggestion, and see how I get on.

Thanks again.

Thanks for the further suggestions.

Duncan, I don't think I'll often be short of daylight with this mill, but I may well end up getting a few R8 collets if I buy one to do this job.

Jason, I'm afraid I haven't got a "proper" lathe yet, only one for woodturning; one is coming as soon as I can work out where it's going to go.

If I were to buy an R8 collet or two, what options have I got for clamping the chuck shaft in the vice [or directly on the milling table] so that I can flip it exactly 180 degrees after milling a flat on one side? The arch-shaped clamps on my vee blocks aren't quite deep enough to clamp down on the chuck's shaft when it's laid in the vee groove, and I'm running low on ingenuity on how to set the job up otherwise.

Thanks a lot for the further replies.

Just to reiterate for a couple of respondents, I can't mill flats on the side of the chuck because it's the only mill holder I presently have; I'd have to buy another collet chuck, or at least a single R8 collet or endmill holder [neither of which I was planning to get] to do the work with. This assumes the material the chuck's made of isn't piggishly hard to mill, which it might be.

The Precision Matthews arrangement, with flats milled on to the sides of the spindle, looks like the best one for ensuring both types of collet chuck [both those with flats and those without] can be conveniently loosened and tightened. Too bad it's not the arrangement on my mill.

Many thanks to everyone for your replies.

No tommy bar for the spindle hole was supplied with the machine. I tried using a piece of round bar stock for the purpose but the hole is only 5 mm diameter and the thin piece of bar bent terminally when I loosened off the nut; this is without overtightening it to begin with, which I was careful not to do.

The pin projection in the end of the C spanner that came with my collet chuck is also too big for the hole unfortunately, and it is square-section not round-.

I've found a temporary solution in the form of a large strap wrench, which just fits the spindle projection on the machine. I would still much prefer to have flats on the chuck's shank, as I'm sure a spanner applied to these would give better feedback for tightening and loosening than a strap wrench, as well as make the whole task rather easier for someone with a brachial plexus injury like me. Much as I like the collet chuck for its lack of run-out and general quality, I'm not sure I want to live with it long term without some flats to put a spanner on.

One other thing as a warning to others: if you have a similar machine and similar collet chuck to mine, don't do what I did and tighten the collet lock nut whilst holding a spanner on the flats of the silver-coloured nut just under the top of the draw bar. You risk inadvertently putting too much preload on the spindle bearings and then wondering why they are getting very warm whilst the machine emits unpleasant noises.

Edited By Bill Phinn on 07/03/2020 14:17:39

I've met with a very basic problem when trying to use an R8 ER25 collet chuck in my Warco WM18: I can tighten the tool in the chuck OK, but when I try to loosen the collet nut [whilst holding a spanner on the flats of the large silver-coloured nut just below the top of the drawbar] all that happens is that the silver-coloured nut [and sometimes the drawbar itself] loosens off but the collet nut doesn't. To change a tool, I have to remove the drawbar and the entire collet chuck from the spindle and hold the shank of the chuck in a soft-jawed vice; only then can I loosen off the lock-nut. It's hardly ideal.

It strikes me that if either the collet chuck had flats on its shank or the spindle of my machine was lockable [it apparently isn't] this problem wouldn't have arisen. Interestingly, I can't see any information anywhere by retailers of machinery and collet chucks of this potential incompatibility issue.

Any suggestions for a best solution to this would be welcome. I would mill flats on the collet chuck myself if I had either a mill in which I could reliably use my present collet chuck or a collet chuck I could reliably use in my present mill! [joking]

Edited By Bill Phinn on 07/03/2020 12:11:05

If you do use kitchen roll for this purpose, just don't put it down the pan after use; it doesn't readily macerate and so can block toilets and drains quite effectively.

Here's my own translation:

新冠状病毒 New Coronavirus
环境温度 ambient temperature

存活时间 survival time [of virus!]
分钟 minutes
小时 hours
飞沫 aerosol
鼻涕 mucus
液体 liquid
人手 human hands

无纺布 unwoven cloth
木质 wood
不锈钢 stainless steel
酒精 alcohol
漂白水 bleach
肥皂水 soapy water

任何温度 any temperature

Edited By Bill Phinn on 01/03/2020 13:14:18

Thanks a lot for everyone's further replies.

John [Journeyman], your experience of things is pertinent in my case.

The M8 hole for the front gib adjusting screw penetrates about 25mm beyond its meeting point with the anterior y-axis locking screw hole coming in at right angles to it, and the locking screw hole is M6. This means that if the brass pusher is, say, 2cm long, the 8mm of empty space [at least] that it has to bridge unsupported before it contacts the gib strip leaves at best only 12mm of the pusher supported in the M6 hole. The chance of the tip flipping left or right and the whole pusher dropping into the M8 channel perpendicular to it seems a distinct possibility.

If this were to happen, hopefully the pusher is slim enough to enable a pick to be inserted down the M8 hole that can then hook the pusher out for reinsertion.

The positive news from my point of view is that peering down the gib adjuster hole reveals no sign of a displaced brass pusher, so we can, I believe, safely assume the pusher is simply missing.

Many thanks to everyone for your replies.

A short while ago I managed to persuade a much younger pair of eyes than mine to peer down the hole - the conclusion: I'm imagining the presence of anything brassy down that hole. Since, also, a long thin drill bit inserted into the hole appears to reach all the way to the near side of the gib, it's difficult to imagine where any brass pusher that may have been in there could have disappeared to, unless the pusher was for some reason ludicrously short.

I'm going to try and get hold of the appropriate pusher from the retailer (sorry, Mark, I did buy new) and hopefully just get on with using the machine.

There does after all appear to be a brass pin in there, only it's very deep in the hole, so deep that it has apparently fallen into a recess in the gib strip. Not sure how to proceed.

I've uploaded one photo of one of the x axis holes with the screw removed clearly showing the brass pin, and two photos of the y axis hole not apparently showing a brass pin. I couldn't swear to not being able to see it, mind you; my eyes are not that good down holes.

Obviously making a brass pin is not going to be any problem. An ongoing concern though is whether there is a brass pin in there somewhere but it has got dislodged sideways somehow only to jam up the y axis at some critical moment. Is this possible, or is there nowhere a brass pin could be hiding other than down that hole?

Thanks for your answers.

I've attached a scan of the relevant page. Slightly unhelpfully, it appears to depict an older version of the WM18 but I think it does show the presence of a brass pin; at least that is what part no. 14 is described as so I'm assuming the y axis is the same.

Is it possible the brass pin is in there but has dislodged from its correct position? If so, how would I go about getting it back into position and having an operable slidelock?

I've recently bought a Warco WM18 and am still in the process of checking things over.

I've met with a bit of a puzzle in the Y axis locking screws. Basically the locking screw nearer the front of the table bottoms out (i.e. goes all the way in) but even then doesn't actually lock the table. I've put a longer M6 screw in just to test how far down you need to go to reach a stop, and it is the full length of the supplied screw plus about 5mm. The female threads in the hole in question are in good condition.

I feel sure there is a simple explanation for this, but it eludes me at the moment. Any help would be much appreciated.

ETA: I should mention that even when a longer screw is inserted and it reaches a stop it doesn't very effectively lock the table.

Edited By Bill Phinn on 15/02/2020 20:14:14

Mike, the base is 42cm along its long edge. Another possibly important dimension for you or others considering buying is the rearward projection of the head/motor assembly beyond the base: projection beyond the rear edge of the base is around 16 cm.

Nor mine, which is the same as Neil's.

Well, I did, albeit consecutively, not concurrently.

The message is, no matter what your handedness at birth you can learn to use the opposite hand just as or almost as successfully provided disability doesn't prevent you and you're determined or desperate enough.