Member postings for DMB

Have to agree with JasonB on this. Need to assess the degree of accuracy required for the job and simple careful measuring with a rule, hacksaw and face cut end, will do, in this instance.

John

Many years ago, I acquired an old flat bed Drummond, badly worn. Used it for a bit, sold it locally and buyer had fellow club member, ex school metalwork teacher help him and made new mandrel bearings for it.

For a young beginner not yet working earning money to buy items listed above, then what I suggested will get newbie started, perhaps with a second hand bench vice on an old table in shed or back of dad's garage.

My local club has lathe small bench drill hefty vice on sturdy bench and massive hacksaw machine, bench toolgrinder, all used by very keen beginner who is there almost every Saturday, beavering away.

Hi Steven

Assuming funds short,l ook at the drawings, make a list of taps and dies needed for any threads. Ascertain tapping drill sizes for only the required taps. Don't buy sets as you will probably never use some sizes. Just go to a supplier like Tracy tools to buy just what you need, including only the size of diestocks and tap wrenches to fit. The foregoing is probably the cheapest way of acquiring only the tools needed. Don't buy second hand as they are all cutters and likely to be blunt, you probably have no means of sharpening them and small diameter taps could snap in the work.   I suggest you take care with taps smaller than 1/8" diameter and use the very next larger tapping drill size to avoid overloading tap and breaking it. Resulting thread still has similar strength.  Join a local club, choose one with a lathe in their workshop and check if someone will be willing to teach you how to use it and make the parts needing turning, boring, drilling. Be aware that your project will take sometime and money to complete but do enjoy the journey and very good luck.

Hopefully, others on here will offer their advice and words of wisdom.

It is this week, a hundred years ago, that the designer of your project started writing in Model Engineer.

John

Edited By DMB on 06/05/2022 08:10:27

So the old chestnut is back, albeit in slightly different form.

1 To keep workshop even slightly warm-ish, you need to use something that's on 24/7, in my opinion (and experience.) Having said that, there is also a timer in circuit, allowing a switch off for a few hours in the warmest part of the day. This being adjusted according to season.

Even a garage can be insulated, the initial cost being recovered in the saving of actual heat.

If heater(s) connected via a thermostat to limit rise in temperature, that should help to make running cost a bit more economical.

Every large machine, e.g., lathe, mill, etc., are covered when not in use, covers will trap heat rising from the heater in the drip tray. Any escaping heat will gently warm the rest of the workshop.

My system works well for me in the "Sunny Sarf" (Sussex) and it hasn't bankrupted me yet.

Yet another problem not mentioned by previous posters here. Topslides are set up to face work slightly concave. If work is faced across the diameter of a faceplate, it may well not end up dead flat.

Might be best to rough out the work in 4jaw as described above, in order to get the bulk of metal removal done quickly then transfer it to mill table, using low profile clamps on the edges, as per Harold Halls.

Edited By DMB on 24/04/2022 22:03:21

Liers favourite: Category/Categorically deny

&

"There is no Evidence" to support/show

Sorry, felt I needed to indicate the context of useage

John

Edited By DMB on 22/04/2022 08:23:20

My take on this caper -

1. I never buy 2 nd hand taps ( or drills) Only new, sharper.

2 Always use methods of guidance as outlined above by others.

3 Try to avoid tapping blind holes, only through holes.

4. If blind hole tapping unavoidable, don't use grease or any kind of tapping sludge, however good it's supposed to be. Only use thin oil. Much easier to wash out swarf from the bottom of the hole with say, paraffin.

5. If in any doubt, use next larger diameter tapping drill.

6. Consult a reputable drill and tap guide table and don't use the smallest drill sizes, look at the percentage clearances. Not normally necessary to go beyond 70-75%. Tight clearances put a lot of extra torque strain on the tap for very little gain in thread stripping resistance.

6. Frequently remove tap and clear out swarf then start again. Smaller the diameter, the more important it is, to avoid swarf compaction at the bottom of the hole. Compaction could break tap and certainly make it harder to remove said swarf.

Hope my notes prove useful to the OP and anyone else in difficulty.

Edited By DMB on 17/04/2022 22:17:36

Somewhere, along time ago, so can't remember where, I saw a list of drill point angles specifically to suit subject, say, Ali, wood, plastic, etc. The usual 118° was quoted as a general purpose, do anything reasonably well. So it seems that those with the suitable grinding jigs could sharpen one or more to a better angle for a special job. Drilling 'awkward' phos. bronze comes to mind. Any 'specials' should of course, be stored and marked, separately.

Still a good idea to drill a big hole in umpteen size stages to lessen heat generation which will affect accuracy. I mention this because I've seen a remark about a large drill with 4facets will do the job in one go. Maybe, but it will still generate a lot of heat.

I do know that if one electrical item fails in a series circuit it works like a switch, whole circuit goes dead. Does it matter in my circumstances? No, because I go into the workshop most days so not many hours with heat off on one machine only. It will still be 'enjoying' the benefit of residual warmth trapped under the plastic covers. Even then, there is a certain amount of warmth in the general workshop atmosphere from the other heater, which is a tubular one, via thermostat and timer. Only off for about a third of the day. It's on Myford drip tray at the back and lathe has plastic cover. Escaping heat warms the rest of the workshop. Only 10x 8ft, so not a very large volume to keep warm. Most of the items, bench, drill, two mills, lathe, all covered against falling dew or even rain from roof, should itt spring a leak. I'm now even growing hedging to keep sun off shed walls to try and reduce temperature rises. There is a plan to put a further thick layer of continuous insulation in the roof apex soon, which will hold back heat transmission in from sun, out due to colder outside temps. It will be a blanket of white recycled plastic. Got a lot left on the £17 roll. Used it to cover loft traphatch in the house, surprised at the difference that it made. BnQ earlier this year.

Edited By DMB on 14/04/2022 15:51:27

My findings over a long period of time, are that sheds don't normally have waterproof wall covering, only the roof. So I have cut large squares of felt nailed and glued to the walls and door so whole outside is waterproofed, which drastically cuts the damp. Insides of the walls and roof insulated to keep cold out, warmth in. Constant low heat stops large changes of temperature and air holds any moisture instead of dumping water content on metal objects. Not been a fortune in outlay but worth it to avoid spoiling tools, machinery, work in progress projects. OK, so some heat escapes when door opened to get in or out but warmer air takes its moisture with it. I have little rust problem. Some tools and materials kept in the house. I use plastic boxes to store small tools and pieces of steel with VPI paper. Tinplate tins and boxes only used to store brass, copper ali, stainless. I have acquired a GHT bending rolls which is very shiny, wonder if it's made from stainless? It's stored in a small metal case with plenty of VPI paper, just in case....

Small hardware shops still stock old type bulbs.

My box, see above, has one side open with the edges about an inch above the tops of the bulbs, to protect them from breakage. Bottom end also recessed to avoid exposure of the (insulated) wiring arrangement.

When bulb supply runs out, may well get small heater. They're made for pianos, would you believe? About (15W?) Aquarium s, Vivarium s, plants as in greenhouses, soil heaters. Just need to look around to gain knowledge of different designs and wattages.

Still use, on occasional loft visits, huge 150W lamp, spreads a lot of light around for short while in use. When it busts, I'll find something else. Case of using up what I have.

I am using Android, have got an app called Barometer. Just checked and it's saying it's 92.9% humidity outside. Nearly an hour ago it was 98. something. This gives me a rough idea how 'bad' the damp atmosphere is outside, down here on the South coast, having had a fog/mist weather forecast this morning. At least it's giving an idea of surroundings so if a shed/ garage being used as a workshop, you have an idea of how much it's being affected by conditions outside. I have gentle heat on 24/7 most of the year. 4 off, 60W bulbs in brass battenholders, connected in series encased in a 3-ply box produce low light but importantly, low wattage heat. Wiring is protected against possible shock risk. Workshop entry routine, switch off heaters, switch off lights. Still use stock of new bulbs for reading indoors but when they get a bit tired, pension them off as workshop heaters. I believe that total wattage is around 15, so X 168/wk = just over 2.5 units a week, x 25p (+ VAT, =30 p) up to recently, =75p. Leccy now jumped to 45 p + (VAT = 54p), total now £1.35/wk. Still very low compared with all else that's going on. That's for one of my mills, under plastic shroud. Tubular heater back of myford drip tray, on thermost. Just large plastic bags over Dore-Westbury mill and Fobco drill and workbenches. Enough heat escapes to warm whole 10 X 8' wooden shed which is heavily insulated.

Edited By DMB on 13/04/2022 09:26:15

I am an old codger, iif you like, but at no time have I praised up Imperial v Metric. Just that I passed through school being taught both systems so I can now happily use either or a mix of both.

However, I think that it's more than time for a complete changeover and join the rest or at least, most, of the world. The other Luddite countries will have to get aroundtoit sooner or later.

If there was a complete change, then far less time would be wasted teaching the obsolescent Imperial system and at the same time make it illegal to quote conversions on milk bottles or saucepans or anything else.

A "dry garage"??? My heated workshop has a humidity gauge on a high up shelf which shows a minimum of 50%, sometimes 55 or 60. I suggest, Phil, that you by a cheapo humidity gauge, which whilst not being accurate, will give you some idea of just how " dry". Put a sheet of ordinary newspaper on the bench for a few days and see what happens. (Don't use shiny paper that's had chinaclay rolled into the surface.)

John

School science lessons, we used "Celsius" except when mentioning "Centigrade Heat Units". How daft can it get?

Taught decimetres but they seem to have fallen by the wayside as never see them mentioned anywhere.

Whilst I think there is some merit in keeping the number of different measuring sizes to a minimum, I think that mm, cm and metres could be used in a sort of prortional way. Vehicles being big objects, why not quote length as say, 19.8m and a person's height as 180cm. Kitchen worktops 60cm but say 50mm thick.

Cross sections of most things could be in mm, except when they get much bigger like diameter of a large tree trunk in cm.

All much better than yds., ft., ins., with the cock-eyed quantities of units making up the next larger unit.

As I've previously stated, I try to work with what I'm given on a drawing. If drawing is metric, use metric sized materials where possible and if necessary, convert an Imperial sized piece to metric before using it. All helps to avoid errors and makes life simpler.

Likewise, with Imperial drawings, use Imperial materials as far as possible and convert an odd piece of metric material to Imperial size before using it.

When I started constructing HH's t&c jig, I couldn't source the specified metric sized pieces of steel in the small lengths required. Our usual suppliers didn't seem to stock what I wanted but Joe at Maccmodels came up trumps with some and another poster on here suggested a business in Hampshire, does traction engine stuff, but cannot remember their name. Sods law operating, I will remember immediately after I add this post! I think things are starting to improve, possibly due to an increase in demand for metric materials.

I avoid exact long division in the head as being one step too far and use multiplication/comparison instead. Well, it works very well for me. Take the previously mentioned 700m/2300ft. From 700m, it's 700yds + another 10%, 70, total 770, which is easy to multiply by 3 arriving at 2300. But, the other way, I can see that 2300 divided by 3 is 700 + the approximate 10% difference between metres and yards, amounts to 2310. Near, so now guess a round 2300.

I have used small sizes approximations so often that I can remember quite a few without having to calculate every time, like 17mm is around 11/16". I do often consult drill tables to ascertain exact next larger size tapping drill, e.g.

Wow, page 4 now, getting late, going 2 bed.

As another example of quick easy calcs in the head, I was at the club one day with a group who were discussing construction of something and they had a mix of measurements like say, 16G sheet to be fixed to some 3mm thick angle and another piece which was say 5/32" thick and the chap doing the measuring and alking started floundering. I quickly reduced everything to Imperial decimals, I called 16 G .0625" as it's close to 1/16", 3mm became .120" less error approx. 2 thou, so .118", 3/32 = .09375, total .27425" Got there so quick, the Tornado simulator service engineer standing near me was shocked, wanted to know how I managed it so quick. If the calc answer is important to be correct, I will still work it out in my head for fun but use a calculator just to make sure of no mistake. I have been wrong, occasionally.

Duncan,

I know about the yanks balls-up. That's why I try hard to use what I'm given, be it Imperial drawing or a metric one. Rules and Verniers have both systems side by side so not difficult.

Mike Poole,

That's precisely why I said that I try to use what I'm given, e.g., HH supplied his tool grinding jig drawings in metric in his book. So I used metric. Could only source some steel sections in Impreial, so I treated them as peculiar sized metric so all was in same system!

Andrew,

Basic arithmetic is my specialty, I think! In the example that I gave, 19mm, double it and again, so we have .760" I find it much easier for head calcs., to do it rather unconventionally, like next stage is having got to .760" on the assumption that 1mm = 40 thou, it's necessary to correct the 'error' being the difference between .039375 and .040000, which is 5/8 per mm , so 5 X 19 = 95, ÷ 8 = very nearly 12(thou) to deduct from .760" = .748", answer damn close to correct figure. Told you it's very unconvential and spelling it out above in minute detail seems long winded but I get there very quickly and it works very well.

Michael Gilligan,

I accept your comment but point is, multiplying/dividing by ten to calculate metric quantities is easy but impossible to match in Imperial, which is what I meant.