Member postings for gary arthur

Many thanks, both.

@ Hopper - you are not the first person that has recommended PTFE tape. I have used it on the input end of my clacks as I was worried that any stray Wellseal might work mischief with the nitrile balls in the valves. I wouldn't rule out using it more in the future, especially in situations where cosmetic concerns are not paramount. ('Gorilla snot...' lol).

@ Neil - that's reassuring. My safety valve will blow off at 45psi. Will keep on trucking with the Wellseal now (also good for 200C) and see how it goes but will bear Boss White in mind for the future. It comes well recommended .

Cheers,

gary

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 16/08/2018 12:35:57

Thanks guys.

Neil - I hadn't heard of Boss White but it looks reasonable to me. I guess the Wellseal would be more forgiving visually if it oozes on to the copper, but it can all be cleaned off anyway .

I note that both Wellseal and Boss White have a top working temperature of 200 degrees C. Could this be a problem? I wonder if parts of the boiler - even those not directly touched by direct heat - might get hotter than that and ruin the thread seals. Remember I'm a clueless beginner...even if I do have good teachers .

Hi -

Tried out the Wellseal this evening on a few fittings.

It's transparent, dark brown, runny and very sticky and looks for all the world like something chocolatey which you might squeeze on to an ice cream from a plastic bottle. You clean any grease from the mating threads (I used acetone), then anoint them with the Wellseal. You then leave them apart for about 5 minutes while the Wellseal thickens up, after which you either add a bit more Wellseal (if required) or just screw them together. Apparently it never really sets, so it's easy to remove the fittings if required and clean it off with a solvent.

I must admit that the stuff inspires confidence - it's so damn sticky!  It gets right into the threads and it's hard to imagine it not making an effective seal. However, the proof of the pudding will be in the testing so I'll let you know how that goes. If it doesn't work I'll try one of the Loctites which you guys have recommended, but for now I remain hopeful.

gary

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 14/08/2018 22:59:40

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 14/08/2018 23:00:46

Thanks Pete -


I gleaned this from the data sheets:

Loctite 5770: After 24 hours @ 25 °C Breakloose Torque, ISO 10964, Pre-torqued to 5 N·m: 3/8 x 16 steel nuts and bolts (grade 5) (degreased) N·m 9.0 to 28.4LMS (lb.in.) (79.6 to 251)
---------

Loctite 572: After 24 hours @ 22 °C Breakaway Torque, ISO 10964: M10 steel nuts and bolts N·m 7 (lb.in.) (60)

--------

ROCOL STEAMSEAL is a high pressure, setting pipe sealant for metallic threaded and flanged joints.

Joints sealed with ROCOL STEAMSEAL are easy to break and clean.

--------

I find this kind of info difficult to interpret, and it seems to me that one can't make a like-for-like comparison between the two Loctites as the parameters are different. However, it *looks* to me that the 572 might be easier to loosen. However, the info that Steamseal is suitable for threaded joints led me in that direction insteaad, so I rang Heritage Steam Supplies in the UK who sell it. They put me on to their tech guy (involved with steam engines all of his life, steam cars and so on) and he advised me against the Steamseal as - he said - it does in fact set pretty hard (because of the manganese in it I think). In fact, he said 'just use PTFE tape - it will work perfectly well'. He was not at all convinced that there is a risk that shreds of PTFE will clog valves and so on.

He did, however, go on to say that if I want to use a sealant, use Wellseal, which does not set hard and is easy to dismantle if required. It can be used as a standalone or in combination with PTFE tape. 'Don't get yourself involved with Loctite and all that stuff', he said.

As a rookie I expected this to be simple but as usual it's tortuous and complex territory, and people have many different opinions. Interesting stuff!

So... given that in the end one has to make a choice, I have ordered a tube of Wellseal. Am not sure about the PTFE tape at this stage - have used it for hydro testing but for steam I might try the Wellseal on its own.

Feel free to comment further, but in any case thanks for all of your input on this.

Will report back in due course

gary

Thank you once again Jason. Might avoid that one then.

Brian - Thank you. I'm quite tempted by Loctite 572. It's cheaper than 5770 and available in the UK. I'm assuming that as you have been happy with it, it must be ok at boiler temperatures. Would you be so kind as to let me know your thoughts on the question of whether it sets soft enough so that fittings will unscrew if required rather than snap off?

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 10/08/2018 08:35:40

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 10/08/2018 08:37:08

Thank you Sir!

Worth considering.

I'm also quite tempted by this, which I noticed was recommended on another forum...

Pete -

very grateful to you for taking the time to help me with this - it's much appreciated and very helpful.

Glad it's not just me who finds the Loctite numbering system 'challenging'!

From what you have said I'll most likely order a tube of 5770 from the USA.

Many thanks,

gary

Pete -

great advice on sourcing materials. I need to go wider!

Meanwhile, I noticed that in another thread you recommend Loctite 592 and in the same thread someone else suggests 574.

How do you feel these compare with 5770?

Am happy to order 5770 from the USA but before doing so would value your opinion on this.

Many thanks,

gary

Hi again Jason and Pete -

Loctite 5770 appears to be pretty much unavailable in the UK as far as I can see.

However, Loctite 577 does seem to be available. Here it is:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Loctite-Thread-Sealant-Strength-Genuine/dp/B00XLPMOPK

It looks the same to me - maybe they just knocked the 0 off the end of the number...

Do you think this is the one?

Don't want to harrass you with silly or obvious questions but I'd rather make sure that I'm on the right track at this point than muck things up later.

Thanks,

gary

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 08/08/2018 23:29:58

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 08/08/2018 23:31:31

Thanks Pete - will look into this.

gary

Thanks Jason.

It's Loctite 2400 'threadlocker' that I'm using. On the packet it says 'designed for the locking of threaded components which require disassembly with standard hand tools'.

Do you feel that a pipe joint sealer would still be better?

gary

BTW you guys have been very kind and I'd like to return the courtesy by reading some more of your threads about your own work. It doesn't seem too easy to search for threads by author (am I missing something?), so if any of you would like to post a link here to your own favourite threads or just name them so I can search for them I'd be very grateful.

Cheers,

gary

Hi -

progress has been slow as I've been away and the hot weather has distracted me from the workshop.

However, I have just taken the black paint off all my fittings with acetone in favour of an all-brass look, and have made a start with Loctite threadlocker. My first experience with the stuff, but it does inspire confidence I have to say.

One slight issue faces me before I can go on to the second hydro test: way back when I was silver soldering in my bushes, I left brass blanking plugs (connected by a steel strip) in the two water gauge bushes in an attempt to keep them parallel. In my inexperience I didn't realise that the brass would be prone to melt, but the plug in the top bush did so. I had to drill it out and for reasons I can't now remember I ended up having to drill and tap it 5/16 instead of 1/4. I then made a threaded sleeve to reduce it back down to 1/4. This seemed ok, but tonight the sleeve sheared when I was trying it out. The upshot is that I'll have to make another one. I'm not overly worried about this as I'm pretty sure that with the Loctite it will be fine, but it's all more time of course...

Will keep chipping away and will post significant developments.

Following an initial cleanup with files, Scotch-Brite and steel wool:

gary

At last!

Successful hydro test today! The boiler is now sorted.

Away for a couple of weeks then on to the next step, which I understand should be another hydraulic test at 1.5 WP with all fittings in situ.

Many thanks for your fantastic help so far - it is truly appreciated.

Well, for reasons which I can't quite figure out I had a struggle with my torches but somehow managed to get the joint looking good.

I *think* the boiler may now be intact but am unable to test it as I sheared off the end of my pressure gauge adaptor when I was tightening it! I'll have to make another one but am going away for a couple of weeks on Saturday so it may have to wait until I get back.

Frustration...!

Hi Neil -

Useful to know; thanks.

I'll grind it back first, then bear in mind what you say when I'm silver soldering.

gary

Thanks Jason.

Well, back at it, then. No other option!

Will probably grind back that overhang first, as per advice offered elsewhere.

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 11/07/2018 07:28:05

Hi -

Following an experience with a leaky check valve during my first hydraulic test, I followed advice and took two remedial steps: replacing the steel ball in the check valve with a nitrile one, and adding a globe valve between the pump and the check valve. This really did the trick, and the result was version 2 of my test rig which has no leaks in the water feed system. When that globe valve is closed, it's closed! Photo below.

And now the bad news: the improved system showed clearly that what I had thought was a repair was an improvement, but not a repair. The offending tube still leaks, albeit more slowly. During the test, the pressure dropped from 90 psi to 78 psi over a 30 minute period - better than it was, but a leak nonetheless. The photo below (top left tube) shows the problem - there is a gap under the fillet which I added, probably due - I think - to insufficient heat during the attempted repair. My plan is to reheat it and try to melt the solder which is already in place so that it will flow around and into the joint more than it has. The boiler is now back in some new pickle for 24 hours to get it as clean as I can prior to reheating it, hopefully tomorrow evening. I will, of course, use plenty of flux and follow the previous advice on giving the whole thing an overall background heat with propane before focusing on the flaw with oxy/mapp.

However, if anyone has any other ideas I'd be happy to hear them.

Photo below:

gary

Edited By gary.a.ayres on 10/07/2018 22:43:26