Member postings for John Horne 2

I finally decided there wasnt enough left around the threads for the drain cocks to do anything drastic so I drilled out the holes just enough to run in a 3/16 x 40 tap and it worked out fine, did the same to the heads and all looks good, I've had fittings into them and I'm happy to continue. Need to make some brass thumb screws for the head to blank the holes and order up some 3/16 x 40 drain cocks. The other thing that made up my mind was that I needed to fit shop bought drains so it had to be a thread suitable.

wow just seen the price of those drain cocks !

Yes Tim ! Tetrachloride, very nasty stuff, we were using it in the 70's but it was banned soon after, I have a very small quantity that came from an electrical rewinding company, it's branded under the name Semso and I think I got it in the early 80's, 30 odd years old and still removes everything including the soles from your boots !

Hi Michael, that would be very interesting to see, I read once that Stuart used Whitworth threads on very early engines which would make sense. I'll wait to see if you find the info, I would rather use original parts as much as possible though sometimes we all have to improvise.

Edited By John Horne 2 on 09/08/2018 18:28:39

Thank you Neil, I've restored a few engines now and made a few from scratch, it is VERY satisfying.

I've decided for the larger tappings to gently drill out by hand and tap with ME, I might have to make up some brass sleeves/inserts but its do-able.

I need to have a think about drain cocks, I want to keep them close to the cylinders, or I might make up a pipe system with only one drain cock at the bottom. The cylinder heads might get some brass caps after re-tapping or I can MIG them in and skim them, I've never had a problem using my mig on cast.

I moan a lot and have been known to use the odd "bad word" but I love every second I spent in my workshop.

Went to the nut and bolt supplier but no luck or help

I found that the long bolt in the flywheel was the same thread as the drain cocks and gave a bit more to measure, the thread is definately under 40TPI .....I held it to a 40TPI ME tap and it looks very close to 38TPI .....cant find a mention anywhere of a 3/16 38TPI thread though.

Got a reply from Kieth Appleton who also thinks the builder has used the "wrong" taps, it would have been nice to find out what they were but I guess I'll never know......got to put that aside and move on now.

Thanks for the idea of using JB weld and re-tapping, I have some very strong cleaner, tetrasomethingorother, it got banned years ago, like most things that actually worked, so I might give it a try.

Thanks Ron, I rang Poly Models who were very helpful but it looks like I have a problem with this, I think the person who built it up might have used taps and dies that he had to hand, maybe something old and obscure....like me haha

I'll drop Kieth an email to see if he has any thoughts but I might be looking at a re-tapping job (if its feasible).

I'm also thinking it might be worth a trip up the coast to a nut and bolt supplier, it's a very old established company so he might be able to help, I'll update this later, thanks guys.

Hi guys, I've just bought a D10 which was in a really bad state, I must admit I didn't realise just how old this engine was till I got it cleaned up and was deciding what nuts and bolts I needed. I got stuck straight off as nothing I had was close and none of my taps/dies/parts fitted anything on it. I know that Stuart used Whitworth threads in the early days so I emailed Stuart Turner to see if they could help, the reply I got said they dont have data going back that far but that it must be 1930's or earlier.

The drain cock holes were plugged with steel bolts which look to be 3/16" but their 38TPI which does'nt match with anything I can find, same size for the plugs in the cylinder head centers which I'm guessing once had oilers fitted.

The cylinder head bolts I'm fairly sure are 3/32" x 48TPI which would make them BSW but I might be wrong !

So I'm wondering if anyone here has info that might help ?

I have ME,BA and Metric taps dies and fittings but none of them are even close.

I added a couple of before and after pics....please dont ask which ones are which

Mon 26/06/2017, Experiment No 37....present are Professor numpty, ably assisted by Bonzo the dog (looking a little concerned).

Ok, I went out and bought a new bottle of meths, different brand (Diall), filled one of my trial wick holders, short piece of wick, lit it, instantly better ! nice blue flame around twice the size of the last try.

"Eureka" I thought.....cracked it

My original burner tube is completely wrecked so I filled up the steel tube I had slotted with cotton wool (which actually burnt the best out of all the wicks and stuff I had tried). Poured in my new meths till it soaked the cotton, ran my gas lighter along it.....nothing.

By this time I was getting just a teeny weeny bit frustrated so I fired up my propane torch and played it along the tube, the slots burst into flame, my joy lasted about 2 seconds as the meths boiled over and ran down the front of the bench, which happens to be a set of wooden drawers, it was also running inside the drawers.

Being well prepared I didn't panic and calmly went to dab out the flames with my trusty oil soaked rag, which burst into flames, meths then ran down my arm from my fireball burner tube, honestly, I just had to laugh, I havn't had this much excitement since my case got caught it the escalator steps at the airport.

Bonzo was last seen heading down the garden for cover.

When I got things calmed down all the slots were burning away merrily, nice and cleanly, so, almost there, and its only taken me a week, lol.

Maybe the other meths was a bad batch or they changed it or it was really old stock, I dont know. I do know that I'll be getting some thin wall brass tube and probably starting from scratch. Who would have thought such a simple thing could be such a nightmare, oh well, I now have loads of meths and a bottle of Blackcurrant mixer in the fridge......cheers !

Nope, I tried it all ways, tight, and to the point where meths runs out the slots, nothing I do will make this thing burn.

I've changed everything now, slack wick, tight wick, different wicks, vented, unvented, slots of every size, even a trough, and now a different burner tube made of steel .....it wont light

The only thing left is to try a different brand of meths.

OK......I took a piece of thin wall steel tube and cut my slots, junior hacksaw width as recommended by a friend online who checked his own burner, cut a nice size vent at one end, pushed in a wick, not too tight, filled with meths, ends plugged......it refused to light, even when I played my torch on it.

I dribbled some meths from a syringe along the steel tube.......it refused to light.

I found an old 1/2 brass blank cap and filled it halfway with meths......it refused to light.

I had already tried a piece of wick in a short length of brass tube and it did light but was pretty weak now that I compare it to things I've seen online.

So I think I'm back to the meths being the problem.

Thanks Ian, I'm going to rig something up with a thin wall steel tube and try variations of wick etc.

I read that both books had been put on microfiche and were available for public access, this happens often when permission is given by the author or authors family, the Gutenberg project is full of such books. I've just done another search and those links are on 4 other forums. I dont know if its possible to find out for sure without applying to the copyright services but obviously I dont want to take a chance, I'll remove the links

I think that went very well, for an encore I might sky dive naked into the girls school up the road......video to follow.

Uhhhhhhh........ I cant edit my original post ! someone remove it please.

Edited By John Horne 2 on 24/06/2017 08:14:56

As the links take you directly to the PDF online and not to the download I didn't think it was important, no one was going to waste bandwidth or their time, I made it clear the links were to boilers and engines, when each PDF opens it gives you the titles. I am new to this forum and finding my way round, if I make a mistake its not through my lack of courtesy.

Oops.......this should have gone in the books section, as they used to say to me at school..... needs to pay more attention !

Thanks to everyone who's tried to help, I think one of the fundamental problems I have is the construction materials, I used brass for the tank, but, being the cheapskate that I am, I used a piece of 15mm copper pipe for the burner tube, which as Maurice and Brian said is taking away heat from the burner, I also think its creating a condensation problem. In my defence I only have my meagre pension coming in so I use what I have, I improvise, and sometimes, I cut corners I should have bought some thin wall brass tube !

We all get something different from our hobbies, for me its the satisfaction of creating something from nothing or salvaging something that everyone gave up on and turning it into something that makes people smile. I got interested in steam a few months back and decided to make an engine similar to the tubalcain twin cylinder/double action/oscillating engine, yes, its a mouthful haha. I bought absolutely nothing for this engine, everything came from my scrap box and what was lying around. I made a few changes to the design and appearance, I think it turned out well and it runs a treat ! here's a pic........

Thanks Gary, yes it might be worth a go, nothing to loose by opening up the slots a bit more and pulling some material through

Just did a search for the book and it looks like the copyright is over so its available for free download........

http://www.appropedia.org/Model_Boilers_and_Boilermaking

There's a link on that page to the download and its legit.

Interesting ! I did open up the slots, in the end I used a file so their wider than the wall thickness, but I did wonder if using copper tube was the right thing to do.

That's quite a list of wicks Dave ! I'm sure that will be useful to other people as well, especially the imperial sizes.

I might order one up and get a different brand of meths, got to do something, by the time I'm finished I could have bought a copy burner from Ebay complete with wick.

Been looking at photos of burners again on google images, most of them look to burn nice and clean without burning the wick to ash.

Edited By John Horne 2 on 22/06/2017 18:25:16

Thanks dave, maybe the flame goes yellow when the wick gets burnt to much ? which would explain my yellow flame but not why its happening the wick in your link is a little too small and looks like the only one they sell, mine needs to be around 12" and 14mm dia to fit snug in the tube, the one I bought from Germany should be perfect, I'm pretty sure other people use that company for burner wicks.

Maybe I'm cursed....or my wicks are cursed.....or both me and my wicks are cursed !

I have some very close up photos of the original burner that I copied and photos of a copied burner, I honestly dont think it can be that far out that it wouldn't light, even if it was it wouldn't explain why I cant get a wick to burn properly in a piece of copper tube ! I might have just found another use for the meths ...................hic !

The last one that came from Germany is exactly like that, multi strand, soft and fluffy when opened up, and made of cotton.

I just found the receipt, it says.... round spirit paraffin or oil lamp wick 100% cotton petroleum wax burners

Edited By John Horne 2 on 22/06/2017 16:30:52